Derby Trail Forums - Mine That Bird

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- The Paddock (http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=2)

- - Mine That Bird (http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/showthread.php?t=31316)

dalakhani

08-23-2009 11:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

What's ironic is that back in the good old days, these horses would win on a regular basis for Pletcher. They'd stretch out and run HUGE. They'd get the worst trips and run HUGE. I really appreciated Kent sending SB and punishing Munnings, and, of course, Pletcher, around the track. Put a nice smile on my face. Kent is good when it comes to things of this sort. I can imagine Pletcher wondering during/after the race what he did to deserve not being able to 'step' these horses up, like he once did.

Can you give me some examples of these stretched out sprinters on dirt that Pletcher use to win with back in the good old days? I use to bet against those types of his all of the time (with the exception of value plus which i will wear for eternity). Looking back, I dont remember many big races at all Pletcher would win stretching out.

edit- I looked it up on his website and it looks like only left bank could be considered a horse stretching out on dirt for Pletcher that ran big. Can you think of other horses that I am missing?

Bobby Fischer

08-23-2009 11:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chucklestheclown

(I just picked thhis at random to use in my reply). As a betting oppportunity, I would rather see Kensei run than Rachael. Anyone agree?

If you are of the opinion that Quality Road is being asked for too much, Kensei is going to be a halfway decent price.

RockHardTen1985

08-23-2009 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby Fischer

If you are of the opinion that Quality Road is being asked for too much, Kensei is going to be a halfway decent price.

Kensei will be the second choice, how is he not?

Bobby Fischer

08-23-2009 11:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RockHardTen1985

Kensei will be the second choice, how is he not?

what?

10 pnt move up

08-23-2009 11:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby Fischer

what?

I think he will be as well, MTB will be the third choice.

RockHardTen1985

08-23-2009 11:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby Fischer

what?

Dude sometimes I really don't know about you. You respond with what????
What odds do you expect if they run him instead of Rachel? I
thinking 3-1, 5-2 second choice.

Bobby Fischer

08-23-2009 11:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 10 pnt move up

I think he will be as well, MTB will be the third choice.

yea we all agree that he will be 2nd choice.

which is a halfway decent price if you think quality road will quit.

whatever it's too late for semantic bullshit

Bobby Fischer

08-23-2009 11:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RockHardTen1985

Dude sometimes I really don't know about you. You respond with what????
What odds do you expect if they run him instead of Rachel? I
thinking 3-1, 5-2 second choice.

exactly , which is why i was confused when you said "Kensei will be the second choice, how is he not?".
it sounded like you were disagreeing.

Antitrust32

08-24-2009 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby Fischer

You are one of the sharper players/cappers on the net, so i always consider what you say. I just don't think the Preakness was close at all.

not only is Rachel better than her competition, but she also dictates the style to a degree. She can go faster than anybody else that hopes to compete. Unlike Zenyatta, who can conceivably lose vs. lesser horses if they run a tactical race against her, Rachel has to regress, or even less likely someone else has to reach her remarkable level. No one has really been at her level on dirt since Curlin's peak. Big Brown probably wasn't as good, even with as much as he overcame in the Haskel and Florida Derby.

In the Preakness Borel ended the race at the top of the stretch. She reached an insurmountable lead at that point and just had to finish, with the diminishing margin not really reflecting a competitiveness for MTB. It can be debated that Borel asked her for her final bid too early in the Preakness. And then that pace was so brutal with the chasers all collapsing so badly, I know being on the lead can at times be much easier than chasing the lead in a pace like that, but it still has to be considered a very hard pace to be on with MTB having anywhere from a moderate to extreme advantage in setup...

:tro:

I find some people's reaction to the Preakness hilarious. Rachel ran hard for 1 3/16ths that day and Mine That Bird ran hard for 3 furlongs that day. She's 5 times the horse MTB/Summer Bird/Munnings/anyone she's faced are. I would like to see her and Quality Road at 1 1/8th... though I think she would win by 5 again.. she may only be twice the horse QR is..

the ONLY reason MTB was so close that day is she had to set some big time fractions and put away some real good sprinters (Big Drama) before MTB got within 15 feet of her at the wire.

Coach Pants

08-24-2009 09:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stonegossard

What are you trying to learn ? That he doesn't like you and feels you have horrible capping capabilities.

That seems to be what you will get form the guy.

You'll occasionally get a selection in the daily thread that will run dfl.

CSC	08-24-2009 02:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

I understand and certainly concur that this is a valid point.

I found Bailey's insight about Cigar in his interview on TVG Legends a couple of years ago really interesting. When talking about the Pacific Classic Bailey admitted that he asked Cigar to do something even he was not capable of, which was to hook Siphon and stay on.

The funny thing about that, which I thought of right away, was that did Bailey really think Cigar was not capable of running down Siphon simply because Geri was unable to in the Hollywood Gold Cup? Did Bailey think that little of him? Not that Siphon was bad but it made you wonder what type of connection they had.

NT

I remembering watching that at the OTB and my first reaction was Bailey made the right move, I read his book also and I thought he was simply protecting Cigar to no fault of his. Obviously he loves this horse but being a Cigar admirer, I firmly believed he lost a step in 96. He was a great horse though, as honest as the higher power has ever made.

Gander

08-24-2009 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby Fischer

yea we all agree that he will be 2nd choice.

which is a halfway decent price if you think quality road will quit.

whatever it's too late for semantic bullshit

Put me down for not agreeing that Kensei will be the 2nd choice.
I am sure Mine that Bird will be.

Kensei may even go as 4th choice behind Summer Bird.

Sightseek

08-24-2009 03:10 PM

From what I hear Wooley is going home a winner regardless of how Mine That Bird runs considering all of the "action" he is rumored to be getting. :D

RockHardTen1985

08-24-2009 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sightseek

From what I hear Wooley is going home a winner regardless of how Mine That Bird runs considering all of the "action" he is rumored to be getting. :D

Lol
True.....

Antitrust32

08-24-2009 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sightseek

From what I hear Wooley is going home a winner regardless of how Mine That Bird runs considering all of the "action" he is rumored to be getting. :D

:D thats my boy!

I only talked to him for a short amount of time but he seemed like the most down to earth dude at Siro's. and I just :{>: :{>: his belt buckle.. wanted to take a pic of it and him and his buddy thought i just wanted a picture with him... so I got a pic with him & was slightly embarrassed (or not drunk enough) to ask if I could take a pic of his belt so I didnt..

Sightseek

08-24-2009 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

You don't strike me as the easily embarrassed type! LOL

Antitrust32

08-24-2009 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sightseek

You don't strike me as the easily embarrassed type! LOL

lol... true.

Well I wasnt drunk yet and it didnt seem right aiming my phone camera at his crotch... not sure if we was married or not.. lol

reese

09-06-2009 09:32 PM

Originally Posted by Gander
The HOF didnt seem to matter in the West Virginia Derby, Smith didnt time it right at all. Borel gave him a crappy ride in the Belmont. Time before that Smith again didnt give the horse a chance (Preakness).

What makes you so sure a guy not in the HOF like Chavez or Lezcano couldnt do any better aboard this horse? Give me a break, its not like this horse has been give good rides and just come up short.
[b]
I'd like to see what Mike Smith could do day to day riding in NY.

[B]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ARyan

My guess is below Mike Luzzi, slightly above Morales[/

Quote:

Originally Posted by ARyan

B].

Talk about being clueless:zz: ..Mike Smith wins Pac Classic on Baffert's 24-1 Richard's Kid

ALostTexan

09-08-2009 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sightseek

From what I hear Wooley is going home a winner regardless of how Mine That Bird runs considering all of the "action" he is rumored to be getting. :D

You have no idea of how big of a star he is. I was at Ruidoso yesterday for the All-American Futurity and the post-parade by Mine That Bird. The guy was a rockstar. They had a booth of actual Mine That Bird memorabilia, and he was not standing right by it, but close by, and there was a line of people standing around to get a picture with him. The only thing bigger than the grin on his face was the drink in his hand all day.

My question now, though, is how much longer are the crutches going to be with him? Are they going to be a permanent prop?

Gander

09-08-2009 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by reese

Originally Posted by Gander
The HOF didnt seem to matter in the West Virginia Derby, Smith didnt time it right at all. Borel gave him a crappy ride in the Belmont. Time before that Smith again didnt give the horse a chance (Preakness).

What makes you so sure a guy not in the HOF like Chavez or Lezcano couldnt do any better aboard this horse? Give me a break, its not like this horse has been give good rides and just come up short.
[b]
I'd like to see what Mike Smith could do day to day riding in NY.

[[b]B]

Talk about being clueless:zz: ..Mike Smith wins Pac Classic on Baffert's 24-1 Richard's Kid

It was a great win for Mike Smith, but was it really all that great of a ride? The horse had tons coming down the stretch and the only horse that wasnt gasping was Einstein.

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