Yes. I undersand that you change the topic all the time , and then blame me once I give you valid answers.

What we are having on here is a debate. Although it is one sided and you are getting clobbered, it is still a debate. Debates do have times when new points are brought up (ie....value) and these points are addressed. It's funny how you start whining that "I didn't say this, I didn't debate about that", but go back, you hit me with all different points and I answered them.

:wf

Actually, I think he's right here. Had Gomez chosen Dunkirk he figured to drop a few points to the 8-1 range and POTN would have drifted up, probably to 12-1 or so. Now they'll both be around 10-1. Believe it or not, there's a lot of people out there who handicap jockeys- especially in Kentucky.

Sorry, but I think you are WAY overestimating this. It's a very big pool.

The size of the pool may mute the effect of the jockey cappers, given it's by far the largest of the year. There's no question that on a daily basis, especially in Kentucky, jockeys get bet (and you hear it from people). Remember when Pat Day's mount would open as the favorite in virtually every race at CD?

I do think they will end up being very similar odds at post time, however.

There were a few people at Ellis Park simulcast who I swore had Pat Day real dolls at home.

That began, however, when it was Pat Day against nobody basically. Whenever you see something like that, it is one dominant rider, like Krone or Bravo ( at one time ) in New Jersey or even Ramon this winter. You don't see that when there are a number of top riders.

Gomez is a fine rider, but so are many of these guys, and this whole thing is internet blather, and really not that big a deal. It is probably a money grab anyway.

What's with the poll?

Trying to score a Justindew VS Stonegossard battle that isn't about the economy is like trying to score a hair pulling - purse swinging - bout between two skinny chicks from the special olympics.

The poll options should be:

A) Stonegossard sucks worse
B) Justindew sucks worse
C) It's about a tie
D) Everyone can go fucl< themselves

Hey, who do you like in The San Juan Capistrano, the race ended about an hour ago. Curious to who you like.

Five horse fields aren't exactly my thing .... but I surely wouldn't have bet the winner at even money.

Don't hate me because I'm beautiful Peter ...

After all, That is actually Justindew's pic as my avatar and not mine.

What sickens me more than anything is that it's such an awful picture of me.

Exactly why it's such an awesome picture.

This is one of the best posts I've ever read.:tro: :tro: :tro: :tro:

it really and truly is signature worthy.

I think we should be more sensitive towards
our smaller brethren. Hanging them on hooks,
watching them squirm like the little monkeys the are
is not comical.

After this event I request permission to toss them.

No doubt about it! The funny thing is the fact that I can actually picture this.

Yea, and just think if there were two jockeys wanting the mount...the suspence as they see who will be picked up and hung up, and the camera panning to the winner and the looser.

I want to put a pic of Freddy in my avatar. Do you have one you could send me ? I checked the police websites in his area , and suprsingly there wasn't a "wanted" picture of him anywhere.

I only wish I did.

so...you're shocked he's not wanted? :D

Yes. I have lost all faith in the police in his area. It is impossible that he isn't connected to some crime. If they prosecuted people for bad opinions on races he would be doing 9 consecutive life terms in Sing Sing.

Southern California

Bob bafferet

yes

Gomez is coming to NY after the Derby and staying into Belmont in the Fall. He may go to California for the Oak Tree meet. He will be in Saratoga.

This will make for an interesting jockey colony, at least at Belmont, with Ramong sticking around as well.

andy - i don't want to get in a spat with you but i just have a few points feel free to bury me:

we are now 4 months into they year - isnt it safe to assume that at a minumum GG will ride more in California this year than NY

I assume he won't be in the winter meet at Aqu in early nov - dec

i assume he will be in Califorina those 2 months , that gets him to 6 months in So Cal

if he spends any other time in Cali won't that mean that the majority of his racing days will be spent is So Cal , and since Bob has more horses in So Cal than Todd didn't that factor into the decision on whom to ride in the derby?

I think it is obvious that Jon White had something to do with the decision.

Actually Gomez has been in Keeneland most of April. So majority of time would be outside of California. Not to split hairs

Ya Think?!:zz:

Didn't Baffert ship many of his horses to Saratoga last year because he was unhappy with (I believe) the Delmar surface last year?

fair eneough

that is correct

This thread is being overanlalyzed to death.
Who really cares?

I'm sure someone can pull up this information, but I'd venture to guess Gomez has ridden a lot more for Pletcher over the past 2 years than Baffert. And do you think Gomez wouldn't be able to sleep at night if he doesn't get some of Baffert's potential "A-list" mounts, if he chose Dunkirk? he's argurable the most indemand jockey in the country.

And if it was strictly a case of "which trainer do you not want to burn your bridges with", you would have to side with Pletcher. The size of his operation and the potential for stakes mounts is greatly superior to what Baffert can offer.

we'll see if garett stays the whole meet at Saratoga the are some others on another racing message board that think garett will spend this summer at Del Mar - will see what happens

Are they also posting their Top 5 Derby Horses on that board?

Del Mar is not racing on Monday's this year. Saratoga is where the $ is. Gomez is staying in NY.

no they have a derby top ten thread you can go over and check it out if you like some additional thoughts for the big race

Since I know you aren't Dunkirk's biggest fan, does this mean that you think Pioneerof the Nile will be a complete toss? If so, I am genuinely interested in hearing your opinion regarding why, because, while I think you may well be right, I believe this colt figures to be one who will give me trouble when I try to determine how to play the race.
On the one hand, the zero dirt starts is an obvious concern, and he obviously hasn't run a race as impressive as Quality Road or I Want Revenge.
But the fact that Empire Maker and Lord at War were both pretty good 9f+ dirt horses makes me think that he might appreciate the surface switch and the stretchout just like the two very nice colts he defeated in the Robert Lewis seemed to do. He also has good tactical speed, has worked well after his last start, and appears fairly versatile.
Do you think he won't like the dirt, or that he just flat out isn't good enough?

i'm not betting on any horse that has not raced on real dirt.

revenge is better than all of these. it doesn't mean he will win but he is the best horse. if comes up muddy i'm going with freisen fire.

including mr gomez.