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MaTH716 06-08-2010 12:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HomerS (Post 655420)
Why is it "bitching and moaning"?

Understand players have been beaten down forever to shut their mouth and take it. Don't see wondering why a business, especially one hurting bad for cash, would run on Thursday instead of Sunday when their own numbers show they do better on Sunday.
What other business in the country would operate like that?

What other businesses customers would be called bitchers and moaners for wanting to send them their dollars?

Sensitive to the employee issue, but lets get real here. Look at all the recent job cuts there. Where has been the groundswell of concern here or anyplace else for those peoples jobs? But now its give the poor people a rest? Dont think could get people to work some OT or something? And again if they took of Thursday wouldnt be an issue.

Besides the employee situation, I just don't know if they could have the venue ready for racing a card on Sunday. Sunset for Saturday was 8:23, the last race went off at 7:50. I have no idea what time everyone got out of Belmont on Saturday, so the staff could start preparing if there was racing the next day. But I'm guessing they wouldn't be able to start to about 9pm at the minimum. I'm not just talking about the grandstand, but the backyard at Belmont which is huge (and I don't believe it's a lighted area either). It's a giant venue, that probably takes some time to clean, plain and simple.

As far as the bitching and moaning goes, I really believe that if they did race on Sunday and the card wasn't up to some people's speed then there would be posted threads about that around here. I just don't understand what the big deal is about one dark Sunday.

Travis Stone 06-08-2010 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HomerS (Post 655422)
Not a very productive comment or way to make a point.

Ummm sarcasm. But I apologize. I hate being unproductive.

parsixfarms 06-08-2010 12:51 PM

2008 was the first year that NYRA did not run the Sunday after the Belmont. For two years prior, divisions of the NY Stallion Series were the "feature" races that day, so MaTH716 is probably correct that, if NYRA were running on Sunday with a big carryover and those races as the "featured" attractions, many on here likely would have been complaining about the quality of the card.

For many of the reasons stated elsewhere in here (the 13-race cards on Belmont Day are only a recent phenomenom), I totally understand why they did not run on Sunday. If I had to criticize the recent racing schedule, in the face of what NYRA officials have acknowledged as a dwindling horse population, it was a mistake to run the Wednesday between Memorial Day and Belmont Stakes Day.

Cannon Shell 06-08-2010 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HomerS (Post 655420)
Why is it "bitching and moaning"?

Understand players have been beaten down forever to shut their mouth and take it. Don't see wondering why a business, especially one hurting bad for cash, would run on Thursday instead of Sunday when their own numbers show they do better on Sunday.

What other business in the country would operate like that?

What other businesses customers would be called bitchers and moaners for wanting to send them their dollars?

Sensitive to the employee issue, but lets get real here. Look at all the recent job cuts there. Where has been the groundswell of concern here or anyplace else for those peoples jobs? But now its give the poor people a rest? Dont think could get people to work some OT or something? And again if they took of Thursday wouldn't be an issue.

Spare us the self pity. I am not particularly concerned for NYRA employees welfare but NYRA management is, which is why this was brought up as a potential reason why they were closed on Sunday. Not because we felt badly for them.

The idea that business on Sunday post-Belmont day is so much better than business on Thursday that all other considerations should be tabled is mistaken. And the irony of people like you always prefacing NYRA with terms like 'cash strapped' ignore the reality that the reason they are cash strapped is that they aren't getting a significant portion of their share of the handle, not that they are making poor management decisions.

I would think that you would be focusing on the final days of Monmouth since you are the Prophet of Doom there as well.

blackthroatedwind 06-08-2010 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Linny (Post 655349)
In the past, NYRA has run on the day after the Belmont but this year they chose not to. I am not sure of the reasons but my guess would be, in no particular order:


This was not the first year there was no racing the day after the Belmont.

blackthroatedwind 06-08-2010 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell (Post 655391)
There were several reasons given.
1. Cleanup after the big event
2. NYRA having run 10 cards in 11 days.
3. Employees worked unusually long hours on Saturday
4. Hangover effect after big days that other venues have chosen to skip
5. Travis showed that there was no handle bump after the derby or preakness showing that they weren't missing out on an unusually good day of racing.

other potential reasons
6. union wages are cheaper on weekdays
7. potential of a carryover is greater due to the nature of the belmont card and only Gales will argue that leadup time isn't better in these situations

Perhaps these reasons arent good enough for you guys but i find it hard to believe that anyone thinks that taking Sunday off wasn't a good idea.

It's also important to consider that pretty much 3 to 4 years out of 10 it will be a Triple Crown attempt, and thus a much larger crowd, which makes running the next day even more problematic.

blackthroatedwind 06-08-2010 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by parsixfarms (Post 655445)
2008 was the first year that NYRA did not run the Sunday after the Belmont. For two years prior, divisions of the NY Stallion Series were the "feature" races that day, so MaTH716 is probably correct that, if NYRA were running on Sunday with a big carryover and those races as the "featured" attractions, many on here likely would have been complaining about the quality of the card.

For many of the reasons stated elsewhere in here (the 13-race cards on Belmont Day are only a recent phenomenom), I totally understand why they did not run on Sunday. If I had to criticize the recent racing schedule, in the face of what NYRA officials have acknowledged as a dwindling horse population, it was a mistake to run the Wednesday between Memorial Day and Belmont Stakes Day.

As I think I mentioned, we had originally planned on being closed Wednesday ( see the Calendar ), but due to the Belmont Draw and general activities it was decided we needed to run that day. It was basically a somewhat problematic situation that we made the best of.

Obviously the original point of this thread is misguided....but you know that.

blackthroatedwind 06-08-2010 02:06 PM

Suggesting we should have closed on Thursday and run on Sunday suggests a complete disconnect. It is, quite frankly, nonsensical.

parsixfarms 06-08-2010 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind (Post 655465)
As I think I mentioned, we had originally planned on being closed Wednesday ( see the Calendar ), but due to the Belmont Draw and general activities it was decided we needed to run that day. It was basically a somewhat problematic situation that we made the best of.

Obviously the original point of this thread is misguided....but you know that.


In the context of your explanation about Belmont Stakes festivities, I can understand why NYRA chose to run on that Wednesday.

That being said, this was the third time this year that NYRA strayed from the past "policy," if one can call it that, of having two dark days after a six-day holiday week (see January 20 [after MLK holiday] and February 20 [after Presidents' Day]) and ran on a Wednesday, creating the situation of having eleven racing days in a 12-day period. It's also scheduled to run on July 7, under the same circumstances. This puts an awful lot of pressure on the horse population if you are going to run 10-race cards on weekends and holidays.

Linny 06-08-2010 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind (Post 655460)
This was not the first year there was no racing the day after the Belmont.

I had forgotten if they were dark last year. It is a pretty recent change, no?
Assuming that any year could produce a TC try, it is a smart decision. A day off is a refresher for all involved coming off a busy time, holiday, Belmont etc.

blackthroatedwind 06-08-2010 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by parsixfarms (Post 655474)
In the context of your explanation about Belmont Stakes festivities, I can understand why NYRA chose to run on that Wednesday.

That being said, this was the third time this year that NYRA strayed from the past "policy," if one can call it that, of having two dark days after a six-day holiday week (see January 20 [after MLK holiday] and February 20 [after Presidents' Day]) and ran on a Wednesday, creating the situation of having eleven racing days in a 12-day period. It's also scheduled to run on July 7, under the same circumstances. This puts an awful lot of pressure on the horse population if you are going to run 10-race cards on weekends and holidays.

We did that in order to have a four day break at the end of January ( since we are legislated to run a certain number of days during the winter period ).

blackthroatedwind 06-08-2010 02:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Linny (Post 655479)
I had forgotten if they were dark last year. It is a pretty recent change, no?
Assuming that any year could produce a TC try, it is a smart decision. A day off is a refresher for all involved coming off a busy time, holiday, Belmont etc.

Yeah, I thought we started doing it in 2005 ( a year after the huge crowd for Smarty Jones ) but another poster said it has been less. I will have to check.

blackthroatedwind 06-08-2010 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HomerS (Post 655480)
Let me try to be clear here. I would have liked to see them consider running on Sunday. And also running on Thursday.

However, if the reason not to run on Sunday was because of "too much" racing for that week, which is argument people are making- I would have elected to close on a Thursday or some other day and run Sunday- when you get more business.

I'm not trying to make it an either or argument. The people saying they were right not to consider racing on Sunday are.

However, if its going to be an either/or argument then I think the numbers show racing on Sunday is better option then running on Thursday.


It is pretty clear why Sunday was chosen. It became even more obvious because of the once-every-14-years situation of Memorial Day being five days before the Belmont this year...however that was obviously not why we chose to close after the Belmont.

Honestly, considering how many people seem to think there is too much racing, it is amazing that anyone would have any problem with this. But, I guess when the name NYRA is attached there have to be people knocking us. That's fine....at least they are paying attention.

parsixfarms 06-08-2010 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind (Post 655488)
We did that in order to have a four day break at the end of January ( since we are legislated to run a certain number of days during the winter period ).

Thanks for that explanation. Makes sense.

Linny 06-08-2010 03:03 PM

BTW makes a good point. NYRA cannot just add or sublract racing dates. Any changes made to the calendar approved by the NYS Racing and Wagering Board must be approved by the board. Each of the 3 tracks is expected to race a certain # of dates as per the R & W Board, with weather or other unexpected conditions being the only typical exception. Applying for and getting changes is a process.
As far as the Sunday after the Belmont, I have attended about 25 or so Belmonts. I live about 3 hours away, so it's a hike. I used to stay over and then hit a beach the next day, or shop in the city or see friends. I am pretty hardcore, I watch racing every day. I bet almost every day. In all those years, I think I went to the track the next day 1 or 2 times. Even for me, after a long day the day before starting with the 3 hr drive, I was usually willing to give it a rest for a day and I imagine I am not alone. God rested on the 7th day, can't NYRA rest on the 14th?

blackthroatedwind 06-08-2010 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HomerS (Post 655501)
We? Do you work for NYRA?

Will repeat what I told the other poster. Be careful about making assumptions about peoples motives or agenda. Especially when they send money to your business.

People can disagree about something and just have honest difference of opinion. Doesn't mean that they are bashing NYRA, or are bitching and moaning or just another complaining horse player.

If you do work for NYRA would think you would want to hear from all of your customers.

You think the CEO of any business doesnt want customer feedback?

Doesnt mean you have to like it all but if you have any business sense you will be respectful of it. Heck you may even find out they have some good ideas even.

Thanks for the lecture.

I have already responded to six different customer e-mails today...and this is one of my days off. If you don't think people at NYRA are interested in our customers' thoughts you are badly mistaken.

That, however, does not preclude me from finding it puzzling that people have a major issue with Sunday being dark. Certainly everyone won't be 100% happy, and that is understandable, but every decision will never work for everybody. But, this one sure feels like a greatest good.


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