The image if Mine That Bird wasn't in the race scenario is scary. The three best 3-year-olds watched today's race from their stalls.

He was 2008 champion 2 year old in Canada . It's not like he didn't belong .

Nope. I'm always glad to see a gelding win. I like to see a horse run more than twice after the Derby.

--Dunbar

I am sure they would have thrived in the swamp.

Any trip notes out the race? NBC showed Dunkirk breaking poorly, FF grabbed a quarter and Hold Me Back had a questionable ride, I thought Summer Bird had a had a trip worth noting, he was one of the few that passed horses in the stretch and maybe be playable at a price in the Preakness or Belmont.

For those trying to make a case for anyone today, remember, this field got smoked by a horse who could not win the Sunland Derby!

Ya know, maybe just maybe 7 weeks is too long to go without real race experience when trying the Derby. Larry Jones notwithstanding, I was very happy Friesan Fire folded. If he'd won, someone would have tried to train up to the Derby from February next year.

--Dunbar

But then if they would have lost too, somebody would be saying that they didn't run their race either. Why is it that when the track is off, people like to say that ONLY the winner ran their race? They did the same thing in 2004 with Smarty.

Facts.
The winner kicked ass today. Simple as that.

Some people said that Pioneer COULD NOT run on dirt. Not that they didn't think he'd be as effective on dirt as on synthetic but that he was a slow turf horse that COULD NOT run on it. They even suggested that anyone that asked the question "how do we know since he's never tried it" were idiots or insane and that the question was crap.

Now the question is whether or not he can run on a fast dirt track and the answer is the same. We still don't know.

Some people hate to be wrong. Instead of giving the winner credit, they'll find all kinds of ways to disparage a horse that obviously ran better than they thought they would. Even if it was in a seven length loss and the 10 best 3yos all scratched out, it was better than he was thought to run. It shouldn't matter if all of the top horses scratched out. If he was a slow turf horse that can't run on it, he shouldn't have finished second at all.

The scenerio is really laugh out loud funny ( and you get a sample of it from some who are still confused in this thread ).

Let's see....the race would have gotten roughly the 97 Beyer it deserved. The usuals would have then accused Beyer of intentionally lowering the number, even though it fit perfectly for the ( then ) first three finishers, in a desperate attempt to confirm his ( actually correct ) opinion that Pioneer of the Nile wasn't particularly fast.

It would have been a real screach!

I would have been badmouthing the field away like no tomorrow instead of puzzled trying to understand how MTB isn't a claiming horse.

In the end wasn't today a day where we should be discussing how the Beyers figures failed in predicting this derby? Frankly I was surprised how badly Dunkirk and Friesan Fire ran today.

Well at least you now have a new tops to your worst classic winners evah list.

The way he ran today - if it can be believed - there is no way that he's not a much better horse than a Sarava or Da Tara.

I just can't believe my eyes this time.

They ran in a gd swamp...

And Beyer will make his little numbers.
That actually mean less than his syn. numbers.
Amazing.

I think BTW has Beyer's look-a-like sex doll.

MTB best Beyer was an 81 down at Sunland. And Birdstone never really cared for the off going . Another reason to shy away from MTB .

Friesan Fire is a phony who's had easy trips in slow paced races - and there was a good chance another great hate of mine for this race - turned somehow my pick -Dunkirk would get his education and run lousy.

How did the Beyer figures fail? Are they supposed to have Mine That Bird running a 110 in his two losses at Sunland?

By far and away the two genuine real horses were both injured. They were supposed to beat this field to a pulp if they ran.

I wonder if Chantal is miffed she lost the mount.

someone on here said they remembered birdstone winning in new york in the slop...i think they must have meant empire maker. the only time i remember birdstone on a sloppy track was when he ran before the derby, they had sealed the surface, and nick zito looked absolutely murderous afterwards.

and mandella used to train him. go figure.

Birdstone broke his maiden in the slop in Aug of his 2 yr season at the 'Toga. He rolled home, like 10-12 lengths. I actually witnessed it in person.