Well, two wrongs don't make a right...but I understand the point. As I've said, I don't understand what she's done wrong...the Derby is a once in a lifetime opportunity for MOST trainers, and all she did afterwards was take her time and then make what everyone seems to think was the correct decision...yet the criticism and attacks on her personally including, in some threads, remarks about her hair, her intellect, her overall looks...hard to take!

Fair enough.. And your point is well taken. For our part, there are certain objectives that are involved with the Stable that are not typical. We're looking to assemble friends at the racetrack with the hopes of doing well with the horse(s) we campaign. Running the filly over her head at KEE was attractive for our purposes in that there was interest in seeing her aptitude on the lawn and an opportunity to bring parters to Keeneland specifically. We understand those that questioned the placement, but we also had the same questions asked when she ran for $50k two weeks ago before she was 2nd beaten 1.25L posting a 77 BSF and T-G '10'.

While your point about owners pretending to believe their horses are something they are not has great merit, criticism of Sanders is based on her outlandish and contradictory statements concerning Teufelsberg and his opportunities for success. If, as she said, the Preakness was 'his best chance in the classics all along', why the Derby run where he had no chance? Team Valor saw the logic in passing the Derby for the Preakness with 'Roxy', and Mark Shuman did as well with Xchanger. Her training record and constant over-reaching with this very nice colt is the topic of discussion, and she has opened herself up to the criticism given the stage upon which she is operating.

The majority of the commentary comes from Cannon Shell? My ONE comment in the whole thread was that I doubted the validity of the supposed 3 million dollar offers for the horse which I will say to you, Jamie Sanders , or whoever else cares to ask. People like you still dont understand that if you want to play in the big leagues that you have to take the criticism along with the accolades. I certainly have never bashed her personally or professionally. I could care less what you think of me, our horse or partners and I'm sure that Jamie could care less what we say on this forum. I applaud her and Donnie for finding a $9000 horse who became a stakes winner. But to say that I or anyone else is unprofessional or unethical because they have dont agree with a horses schedule is stupid. If you lack the ability to understand the difference between horses racing in the Triple Crown races and horses owned by people in an internet forum then maybe you should reconsider your posts bashing Steve Byk and myself

So, WHO was it that STARTED this topic in the first place and who was it that also gave it the condescending title? Your indignation is misplaced.

So what? As far as I know people are still allowed to make condescending remarks. Is your point that she is a good trainer or that people should not be allowed to voice an opinion that they think she is lousy because of some professional code? Either way I think you're all wet.

I did not "start a topic", I posted a NEWS ARTICLE. If you found it "condescending" then why would you read it? If you think that we are not free to question trainers, jockeys, owners, horses, then why are you here? I thought it was in poor taste to knock Jamie's personal attributes but why in the world are we not allowed to question her moves with the horse? That's what a forum is for, for discussion. If you dont like the discussion then say what ever you want but dont take offense when you become the target.

Seems that you are the one that is offended. Why is it OK for you to question someones moves with a horse but not OK for anyone to question yours? As I stated above....People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.

Where did I ever say that no one can question moves with my horses? You and others questioned running a 15000 nw2 horse in an allowance race at Keeneland. I had my reasons and publicly stated as such. You obviously didn't agree with that move but I dont care what people think because it was that race had her ready for her last race, where she ran pretty well for an overmatched horse. I am not offended by anything you said however I find it odd that you would call me out by name when I said almost nothing in the entire thread.

My turn! Here is what we bash her about,FL.Of the 6 times this horse ran a mile or more,he won ONCE,in the Southwest stakes with an easy lead,and a day Hard Spun was having a bad day.All the rest of them,He tired BADLY,especially after setting fractions in the Blue Grass that most of us could have walked faster.His only GRADED STAKES EARNINGS are a third place in the Rebel,where he was tiring BADLY AGAIN,and in a six furlong sprint,where he had an easy lead of 2.5 lengths and GAVE IT UP!!!!! There is nothing here at all to suggest he belongs in the derby or in any other triple crown races. He got into the Derby by the hair of his chinny chin chin because of defections by other horses,and once again,got his ASS HANDED TO HIM.What part of this do you not see in his PP's?Yet this woman continued to enter him in tougher races at further distances.It is quite clear to most of us here that how she enters this horse and other horses under her care,that she does not know how to read a condition book.And Somerfrost,she did NOT take her time to make a decision.She said to the media 2 days after the derby he was going in the preakness,so so much for that statement.
As far as the rest of your comments FL,I do not give a rats ass what you have to say.If you don't like it here,you are free to leave anytime.

Saying and doing are two different things, many many times a trainer will indicate a horse will run in this or that race only to announce later that would not be the case. The horse lost the grade one Blue Grass by a neck...it was indeed a slow pace but with a 4 horse photo AND the fact that the Derby winner finished second, why not try? Third in the Rebel to Curlin who accounted for most of that margain despite not being prepared for the start and racing wide (DRF comments), Third in the LeComte (G3) to Hard Spun despite bobbling at the break (DRF)...in fact, according to the DRF, the horse hadn't broken well in 5 of last 6 starts and still was 6/3-0-2-1. Certainly the 10f was a question but she had a horse that was performing as well as half the field. Certainly on paper, there was more justification for her horse than Imawildandcrazyguy...yet he ran big! Point is...you just don't know and as I said before, the Derby is every trainer's dream and MOST never make it...why in the world wouldn't she have the right to try???

Luck...

She got lucky with him. If you think it's anything besides that, I want to know what you're smoking.

I second that!!! And I think you need to look at the PP's a little differently than you do.

You guys are missing his point. It is a personal shot at Steve and I. Reread all his posts. I have no idea where it comes from or why but this is not about Tuefelsburg or Jamie Sanders.

My love, I have never agreed with you more -- even that time you said I was the coolest person you'd ever met in the car ride to Ft. Lauderdale :D

Really, my point is that you could every person who got a horse for 8K, and see the success rate. That she got a good horse for 8K is certainly a huge part of making her win percentage 2% instead of .07% -- and she's doing everything she can to take that good deal and run him into the ground.

Well if you hadn't run a nag over her head, it would be a moot point and you'd be watching this conversation from the sidelines, right?

Right. :D

I am just so offended by that!!! LOL

so then i'm taking it that Fearless won't be at churchill on the 25th, wearing a DT hat??

YOU should RE-READ them again because it is obvious that YOU have missed the point.

In fact, YOU should RE-READ Steve's posts as well. To his credit, he is intelligent enough to understand my point and replied accordingly. As for the rest of the respondents...the idiotic comments speak for themselves.

Fearless makes me look like an angel
:)

last I knew they were looking at the Woody Stephens on the Belmont S undercard for T'berg. I have no issue with where she runs him or how often. She owns him! She also rides him every day. Now, I do think that he's better off at G2/G3. In the long run most of the Derby horses in any given year prove to be far below G1.

Were he mine, I'd be looking at races like the "G2/3 Derbies" in W. Virginia, Penn., Ohio etc. Once the Derby prep season destroys a decent % of the crop, those races are often ripe for picking.

As for his slow Blue Grass fractions, it seems that front runners who actually had "normal" early fractions held on BETTER. In fact horses that may be better than T'berg ran slower early and failed. Slowing the pace to (literally) trotting horse time, was not the way to win at KEE.

He's by J'berg so who knows, maybe he can turf. If he likes grass, it may be good for him with his slow starts. Since they usually go slower early and he has rateable speed, he wont have to work as hard as he does on dirt to make the lead.