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tanner12oz 03-23-2014 05:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmayjr (Post 970553)
question-
I was at work, so didn't watch any race on the card except for the replay of the Spiral. Was the track speed-favoring yesterday?

Nobody closed in the Spiral. I mean Artie and Asserting Bear kinda did, but they were close-up... Just wondering if the kickback ate up the closers or? I get as far as horse's potential on dirt there wasn't much in this field, but so many in here were eligible to move up on synth and it just seemed like "first to the front, wins" (Solitary Ranger the exception).

Just wondering if the connections of a lot of these may draw a line through the race and try again in 3 weeks either in the Bluegrass? Poker Player was originally pointed there anyway?
the track appeared fair to me

outofthebox 03-23-2014 06:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Payson Dave (Post 970592)
Honor Code now off the Derby Trail with slight tear in upper hind suspensory per Mike Welsch
Tough break. But i never had the feeling he was on the Derby Trail..Behind the eight ball all winter..

pmayjr 03-23-2014 09:36 PM
it'll be very interesting to see who tries to come back in the Bluegrass and Ark Derby in 3 weeks from the Spiral and Ark Derby.

Gotta think Commish to the Ark Derby, right?

I kinda hope that Poker Player and Tamarando get one more chance in either the Bluegrass or Ark Derby, because no one closed in the Spiral yesterday. Were they inferior, or did the track play a certain way?

RockHardTen1985 03-23-2014 09:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmayjr (Post 970751)
it'll be very interesting to see who tries to come back in the Bluegrass and Ark Derby in 3 weeks from the Spiral and Ark Derby.

Gotta think Commish to the Ark Derby, right?

I kinda hope that Poker Player and Tamarando get one more chance in either the Bluegrass or Ark Derby, because no one closed in the Spiral yesterday. Were they inferior, or did the track play a certain way?
People closed. The 2 speeds finished 9th and 11th. Tamarando is just not very good, I mean he is supposed to out finish Artic Slope, right?

pmayjr 03-23-2014 11:06 PM
there were only 2 that closed- We Miss Artie and Asserting Bear, but they were close-up in a stalking position. Artie barely got there after hanging most of the lane, and Asserting Bear flattened out. But yeah with the speeds holding kinda inexplicable what happened to Solitary Ranger.

I thought going into the Spiral and Sunland Derby that a few were entered here to have a last chance in 3 weeks if their horses didn't do well enough to qualify. Now we wait and see who tries again from these races

booner 03-24-2014 08:50 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kasept (Post 970517)
Undoubtedly.. Time stands still when it comes to those late noms. :D
Just like the horses loading into the gate before the first race of the Rainbow 6? :D

booner 03-24-2014 08:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmayjr (Post 970751)
it'll be very interesting to see who tries to come back in the Bluegrass and Ark Derby in 3 weeks from the Spiral and Ark Derby.

Gotta think Commish to the Ark Derby, right?

I kinda hope that Poker Player and Tamarando get one more chance in either the Bluegrass or Ark Derby, because no one closed in the Spiral yesterday. Were they inferior, or did the track play a certain way?
Gotta think the connections would give him one more try after that bad start. I think he deserves it....

Arletta 03-24-2014 06:48 PM
For those interested. Horse Player Now's "Countdown To the Crown"

http://issuu.com/horseplayernow/docs/c2c_final_merge

tanner12oz 03-24-2014 06:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by booner (Post 970768)
Gotta think the connections would give him one more try after that bad start. I think he deserves it....
I think this horse is live..kinda asking alot for 3 races plus shipping 3 times over the course of about a month though

pointman 03-24-2014 07:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tanner12oz (Post 970817)
I think this horse is live..kinda asking alot for 3 races plus shipping 3 times over the course of about a month though
Live for what? A NW2L?

Kasept 03-24-2014 08:31 PM
Late nominations to the 2014 Triple Crown includes (with owner, trainer).

• Big Tire (Halo Farms/Mark Glatt)
• Charleymillionaire (Red Oak Stable/Gregory Sacco)
• Dance With Fate (Sharon Alesia, Bran Jam Stable and Ciaglia Racing LLC/Peter Eurton)
• Effinex (Tri-Bone Stable/David Smith)
• Fabulous Kid (K.K. Jayaraman and V. Devi Jayaraman/William Martin)
• Friends with K Mill (Neil Haymes, Dave Kenny and Wonderland Racing Stables/Doug O' Neill)
• Gaining Ground (Donald P. Ogden/Michael Wilson)
• Harry's Holiday (Skychai Racing LLC, Terry Raymond and Jana Wagner/ Mike Maker)
• Tonito M. (Triple M. Racing Group LLC, Jerry Hollendorfer)
• Twenty Percent (Neil Haymes, Dave Kenny and Wonderland Racing Stables/Doug O' Neill)

pmayjr 03-25-2014 12:43 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RockHardTen1985 (Post 970752)
People closed. The 2 speeds finished 9th and 11th. Tamarando is just not very good, I mean he is supposed to out finish Artic Slope, right?
also, if that's your stance on Tamarando, do you take a similar one for California Chrome? Tamarando has arguably come the closest to Cali Chrome lately

cmorioles 03-25-2014 12:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RockHardTen1985 (Post 970752)
People closed. The 2 speeds finished 9th and 11th. Tamarando is just not very good, I mean he is supposed to out finish Artic Slope, right?
Don't horses just sometimes run clunkers? I mean really, I'm no big Tamarando fan, but that race was too bad to believe.

pmayjr 03-25-2014 12:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmorioles (Post 970829)
Don't horses just sometimes run clunkers? I mean really, I'm no big Tamarando fan, but that race was too bad to believe.
totally agree, posted this in reply to Steve's ATR thread yesterday
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmayjr (Post 970827)
thank you for asking... yeah Catalano didn't seem to make excuses. He just said "we took our shot..." and will go back to the drawing board with something else. But I think there might've been some excuses/reasons to try again-

For me, since it seemed like no one closed in the Spiral, I just wonder if the track played a certain way or there was major kickback issues or something. I mean, were Tamarando and Poker Player really THAT inferior?

Artie closed, but he was close to the lead and actually hung pretty bad in the stretch before finally getting his nose down just in time. Asserting Bear also made a closing move, but was also close to the lead and flattened out badly.

That's why I wanna see another try from some of these in 3 weeks. I think honestly that's why a few of these were entered in this race and the Sunland Derby, to give them one more chance if things didn't work out in those races over the weekend, to have another chance 3 weeks later.

I'd also like to think that in the case of both Tamarando and Poker Player, that when they were asked for run, and neither responded, that the jocks took their foot off the gas pedal. Neither horse probably came out of the race all that worn out. So we'll see what happens in the next week or so.

The reason I care in the case of Poker Player, is he seems like he's bred to run all day on dirt, and Catalano has run him only on synth and turf races. I get a lot of that has to do with being based at Arlington and Keeneland. And to PP's credit, he's been a solid performer. I just really wanna see him get a shot to run on dirt.
The question is, what does Hollendorfer do with Tamarando? Probably won't have enough point so to qualify for the Derby. Do you try again in 3 weeks? Maybe even the SA Derby in 2 weeks if the Spiral didn't take much out of him? Train up and wait/see if there are defections? Even if he does have enough qualifying points, will Hollendorfer even bother entering him in the Derby?

But I'm with you, the horse has been so consistent, and the Spiral, even with a lot of the entrants being way better on synth than dirt, was not murderer's row. I wanna think this was just a bizarre bump in the road

Alan07 03-25-2014 02:15 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmayjr (Post 970830)
totally agree, posted this in reply to Steve's ATR thread yesterday


The question is, what does Hollendorfer do with Tamarando? Probably won't have enough point so to qualify for the Derby. Do you try again in 3 weeks? Maybe even the SA Derby in 2 weeks if the Spiral didn't take much out of him? Train up and wait/see if there are defections? Even if he does have enough qualifying points, will Hollendorfer even bother entering him in the Derby?

But I'm with you, the horse has been so consistent, and the Spiral, even with a lot of the entrants being way better on synth than dirt, was not murderer's row. I wanna think this was just a bizarre bump in the road
I would have to think the American Turf on Derby day is a possible spot

RockHardTen1985 03-25-2014 02:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmorioles (Post 970829)
Don't horses just sometimes run clunkers? I mean really, I'm no big Tamarando fan, but that race was too bad to believe.
Yes. I guess he ran a clunker, but he can still be not that good, right?

RockHardTen1985 03-25-2014 02:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmayjr (Post 970828)
also, if that's your stance on Tamarando, do you take a similar one for California Chrome? Tamarando has arguably come the closest to Cali Chrome lately
Im not a fan of California Chrome at all. I dont think he will win the Santa Anita Derby and for him to be 5-1 in a Derby future is insane IMO. I would not bet him right now at 100-1 w/ someone elses money.

pmayjr 03-25-2014 09:51 AM
I don't think California Chrome will win the Santa Anita Derby either. I think Sherman didn't wanna enter him, but he knows an 8 week layoff into the Derby is too long. So he felt forced to. I'm not saying the race is just a paid workout for California Chrome, but I think if he gets into a pace duel or a battle in the stretch, I think Victor Espinoza will be instructed to not exert him too much here. The goal is May, not this race. So I think California Chrome loses for that reason. Theyre racing him to keep him sharp, but at the same time don't wanna use him up before the Derby.

Indian Charlie 03-25-2014 09:54 AM
So, in other words, we should all take the 5/1 on California Chrome?

pmayjr 03-25-2014 12:42 PM
lol no. He'd have to romp in the SA Derby to make 5/1 good value. Otherwise you'll get that on Derby Day anyway

RockHardTen1985 03-25-2014 05:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Indian Charlie (Post 970844)
So, in other words, we should all take the 5/1 on California Chrome?
Maybe, Im wrong a lot.

Kasept 03-26-2014 12:26 PM
3/29/14 Florida Derby 1 1/8M - GP:

1 Wildcat Red Velazquez J R 122 L
2 Matador Leparoux J R 122 Blk-On L
3 Cairo Prince Saez L 122 L
4 Constitution Castellano J J 122 L
5 East Hall Leyva J C 122 L
6 General a Rod Rosario J 122 L
7 Allstar Bocachica O 122 L
8 Spot Lanerie C J 122 L


3/29/14 UAE Derby 1 3/16M (S) - MEY:

1 1 Safety Check (IRE) Buick W T Appleby Charles 121 30-1
2 2 Paximadia (AUS) De Sousa S A bin Suroor Saeed 131 15-1
3 3 Cooptado (ARG) Dobbs P J Watson Doug 131 8-1
4 4 Long John (AUS) Barzalona M Appleby Charles 131 3-1
5 5 Giovanni Boldini Moore R O'Brien Aidan P 121 5-2
6 6 Emirates Flyer (GB) Fallon K bin Suroor Saeed 121 30-1
7 7 Sir Jack Layden (GB) Dettori L Brown David H 121 20-1
8 8 Toast of New York Spencer J Osborne Jamie 121 20-1
9 9 Asmar (IRE) Hughes R Nass Fawzi A 121 6-1
10 10 Sir John Hawkins O'Donoghue C O'Brien Aidan P 121 12-1
11 11 Jallota (GB) Crowley J V de Kock Michael F 121 30-1
12 12 King Rubi (GB) Hamelin A Palussiere M 121 30-1


3/29/14 Louisiana Derby 1 1/8M - FG:

1 Intense Holiday Smith M E 122 L
2 King Cyrus Graham J 122 L
3 Louies Flower Mena M 122 L
4 Flat Gone Desormeaux K J 122 L
5 Gold Hawk Bridgmohan S X 122 L
6 Vicar's in Trouble Napravnik R 122 L
7 Commanding Curve Albarado R J 122 L
8 Rise Up Melancon G 122 Blk-On L
9 In Trouble Rocco J S Jr 122 L
10 Albano Clark K D 122 L

Kasept 03-26-2014 12:27 PM
Would it be terribly offensive to suggest a Tourette's Exacta...

Vicar's in Trouble-In Trouble

FATPIANO 03-26-2014 12:38 PM
In Trouble Vicar's In Trouble

FATPIANO 03-26-2014 12:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kasept (Post 970937)
Would it be terribly offensive to suggest a Tourette's Exacta...

Vicar's in Trouble-In Trouble
Seriously Steve,

what do you think of In Trouble's chances in this race?

Arletta 03-26-2014 12:50 PM
Well, I would hope no horses find "trouble" in the race... would be a bit of a tongue twister for Dooley :p

tanner12oz 03-26-2014 01:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by FATPIANO (Post 970939)
Seriously Steve,

what do you think of In Trouble's chances in this race?
I have about 1/100th of the knowledge of the game as Steve but I LOVE In Trouble in this race....I think this horse is going to be very dangerous over the course of the next few months

FATPIANO 03-26-2014 02:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tanner12oz (Post 970950)
I have about 1/100th of the knowledge of the game as Steve but I LOVE In Trouble in this race....I think this horse is going to be very dangerous over the course of the next few months
thank you, debating on adding him to my Winstar Fantasy Derby Stable for this weekend,

Danzig 03-26-2014 04:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kasept (Post 970937)
Would it be terribly offensive to suggest a Tourette's Exacta...

Vicar's in Trouble-In Trouble
i'd be tempted to play an 'intense holiday-vicar's in trouble/in trouble' exacta. :)

Kasept 03-26-2014 08:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by FATPIANO (Post 970939)
Seriously Steve,

what do you think of In Trouble's chances in this race?
Think he was terrific in the Gotham and ideally will be tighter here. Having the other speed in Albano on his right and blinkered Rise Up to his left almost assures that the three hook up from the bell. Vicar's in Trouble the beneficiary of draw this time around as he can set up shop behind the three speeds.

Feels like this is going to be honestly run and In Trouble will have to prove at least a little special to withstand early running and have something for several stages of challenger later.

letswastemoney 03-26-2014 09:03 PM
Intense Holiday looks VERY good. He closed off a slow pace last time, had a wide post in the Holy Bull. The setup will be a dream...unless the other jockeys box him the entire way somehow.

pmayjr 03-27-2014 01:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by letswastemoney (Post 970982)
Intense Holiday looks VERY good. He closed off a slow pace last time, had a wide post in the Holy Bull. The setup will be a dream...unless the other jockeys box him the entire way somehow.
that and he was actually boxed in from making his run. An earlier closing run and I think he would've romped in the Risen Star

tanner12oz 03-27-2014 05:29 AM
Havana seems to be off the trail..
anything official yet?

declansharbor 03-27-2014 09:21 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tanner12oz (Post 970997)
Havana seems to be off the trail..
anything official yet?
Thought I saw somewhere that they were pointing him towards the 7 furlong Bay Shore in early April.

FATPIANO 03-27-2014 09:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kasept (Post 970980)
Think he was terrific in the Gotham and ideally will be tighter here. Having the other speed in Albano on his right and blinkered Rise Up to his left almost assures that the three hook up from the bell. Vicar's in Trouble the beneficiary of draw this time around as he can set up shop behind the three speeds.

Feels like this is going to be honestly run and In Trouble will have to prove at least a little special to withstand early running and have something for several stages of challenger later.
Thanks for your opinion, I do agree the three speeds hook up early, I am not convinced In Trouble will be around at the end, I think he came here to avoid Social Inclusion in The Wood.

NTamm1215 03-27-2014 09:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tanner12oz (Post 970997)
Havana seems to be off the trail..
anything official yet?
Havana was off the trail when he missed the Swale. And he was barely on it before that point.

cassie 03-27-2014 10:17 AM
anything on indianapolis.

FATPIANO 03-27-2014 11:38 AM
Is Baffert running Hopportunity in SA Derby, or going str8 to Kentucky?

NTamm1215 03-27-2014 11:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cassie (Post 971011)
anything on indianapolis.
Not running any time soon. Last work was February 5.

pmayjr 03-28-2014 07:30 PM
http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-raci...arkansas-derby

Per Bloodhorse article, Borel gets mount on Conquest Titan

Kid Cruz won't run in the Wood, because Linda Rice had to give him 10 days off training


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