1 Lava Man 6 6 0 0 $2,470,000
2 Barbaro 5 4 0 0 $2,203,200
3 Bernardini 6 5 0 0 $1,610,480
4 Bluegrass Cat 7 2 4 0 $1,547,500
5 Lawyer Ron 7 5 1 0 $1,340,800
6 Showing Up 7 5 0 1 $1,130,500
7 Fleet Indian 5 5 0 0 $1,113,720
8 Cacique 6 2 3 0 $994,432
9 Invasor 3 3 0 0 $990,000
10 Wait a While 7 4 1 2 $880,807

But can you name ONE that was good? LOL

I agree with you. I don't think that Lawyer Ron is nearly as good as Bernardini but I hate it when people ask who a horse has beaten. If a person has any scouting ability at all, they can tell whether a horse is good regardless of who he's beaten.

Bernardini hasn't beaten any great horses on their best day. Sweetnorthernsaint didn't run anything close to his best in the Preakness. Brother Derek didn't fire in the Preakness. Bernardini beat nobody in his first race this summer. His last race is the only race where you could say he beat a pretty good horse in Bluegrass Cat. BGC may not have run his best that day but I think he ran close to his best.

By the way, Lawyer Ron kept beating that grey horse over and over again. That grey horse ran 3rd in the Ky Derby.

LR is a very good horse. He's not nealy as good as Bernardini but neither is anyone else. LR is in the top handful of best 3 year olds.

If you can't understand that you are arguing the same thing, by saying that LR beat no one, but Bernardini has beat all of the ones they put in the gate, how is that not contradicting yourself...I guess you are too assinine to figure it out...

Its nice to be in those three year old restricted races and have all of the races you run in come up light. A horse can win a lot of money.

The connections should be applauded for a well run campaign. Winning 1.3 and not beating good horses is a hell of an accomplishment.

Isnt that "grey horse" still eligible for nx2 competition?

I'm a Lawyer Ron fan and I'm not making excuses although it is obvious that the horse could have possibly won the race if he wasn't so rank early own.

Lawyer Ron is not as good as Bernardini...no way.

However, Lawyer Ron is definitely in the top tier of the 3 yos. He is 5th on the earnings list of all horses of this year. I really like the colt. If spotted right, this horse will go on to win many more stakes races. He probably could have beat SC yesterday if he would have settled. That WAS NOT his best performance as he was very rank early. I really think that LR is improving too, at least, since this spring.

I think he stands a shot to win races such as the Cigar Mile if prepared properly. However, he should not be put in races such as the BC Classic. At this point, I really think that he has distance limitations as I have probably said many times throughout this thread...

I'll tell you what Roses, we can set up our own future book right here and i will give you 50-1 right now if you want to take Lawyer Ron in the cigar.

I don't know who is in the race and I don't know if he will go to that race or not. Plus, I don't like future bets. However, if he does go, I will tell everyone on this board what I think of his chances. Because the top horses in the country normally run in the BC Classic, it is usually the second tier GI horses going in the Cigar Mile. I think that LR is talented enough to be a second tier GI horse at that distance.

thing is, just like every other year, anyone can come to arkansas. purses are high everywhere for 3 yo's in the spring, the florida derby also offers 1 million. blue grass stakes with 750k...but no sinister minister in the top ten.

all i know is, if lawyer ron is so bad, than maybe oxley and ward better reconsider going to the bcc with strong contender...since he's only managed to beat a horse yesterday who evidently has only beaten bad horses. you'd think a bunch of other bad-horse-beaters would come to ark for the easy money as well...
i hope some day i own a rotten mule like lawyer ron, i'll be laughing all the way to the bank.

That's ridiculous. I could say the same thing about practically every good 3 year old. Who did Barbaro ever beat before the Derby?

Giacomo, on the other hand, beat some good horses in the Ky Derby. Does that prove that Gicaomo is a great horse? Not al all. He beat some great horses in the Derby but none of those horses ran their best that day. It's not who you beat. It's how you do it. You'd never make it as a bloodstock agent if you were constantly asking who a horse beat. Yuo won't be very successful as a bettor either. If you can't pick out a good horse until he beats a great horse in a fast time, you'll end up betting on nothing but 3-5 shots.

and i agree completely with that! they can't all be top tier.
like i said, different folks will always question what horses beat. thing is, the horses have no control at all over who they face. all they can do is try their best. thank goodness for the horses mental well being, they can't read!! they'd all be in therapy!!

Does that mean he has to give back the money he's won?

I never once blamed the jock, I don't think it was his fault, maybe he should have let him run, but who knows if that would have made a difference...I said the whole thing is on LR...He should have won yesterday, but he didn't, no excuses from me, he went too fast too early...

SC ran a huge Sheet # at Belmont, he's a much better horse than I thought, for LR to run like he did against him really impressed me...I am tired of this conversation and I am out...I should be happy, the Bengals won today...I am sorry Dahoss for using the F bomb on you, that was uncalled for, but I didn't like the tone you were using with me...I edited the post and pm'd Kasept to tell him what I did, I feel bad for doing that...It's just a message board and I shouldn't get so heated...

high cotton-graded winner and graded placed since the ark derby.

also, do i think strong contender has a shot? as good as some maybe, not as good as others. he still has a lot of upside, he's lightly raced and seems to be improving. who knows?! hell, volponi won it, why not SC?

Why does everyone think that Barbaro is so good then. The Derby must have been a really weak field if a horse who is eligible for nx2 ran 3rd.

This is why it is so pointless to ask who a horse beat. It's not who they beat, it's how they do it. There were people who were asking who Bellamy Road beat in the Wood. He won by 18 lengths and people are asking who he beat. It's unbelievable.

Who did Discreet Cat beat the other day? Who cares who he beat! It doesn't take a genius to see that he he ran incedible and he is no worse than the 2nd best 3 year old in the country right now. The only horse who might be able to beat him is Bernardini. It's amazing that I know this despite the fact that Discreet Cat didn't beat anyone the other day.

It was amazing that people figured out that Henny Hughes' comeback at Monmouth was a great race despite the fact that he didn't beat anyone that day. The fans must be geniuses. They made Henny 4-5 in the King's Bishop. Did you think he sould have been 10-1 that day since he didn't beat anyone at Monmouth?

High cotton? LOL

wish i knew who beat bernardini in his first start. that horse is obviously THE BEST three year old, since he beat bernardini.

he asked a question, i answered it. it's a fact, sorry you don't like the answer.

I disagree. There have been plenty of horses that have made false reputations against bad horses. Happens every year.

And even going by your line of thinking, what was so impressive about LR's races anyway? He has beyered over 100 but twice going into yesterday's race.

Private Vow, wasn't he a G1 winner?

Oh, we can't count that, because that was some other time and doesn't fit the arguement...

Arkansas Derby

Strong Contender had a brutal trip in the Haskell. Watch the replay. All his naysayers said he could only win going one turn, that he was a very bad 0 for 2 going 2 turns so he was a toss out yesterday. LOL! Tossout. This horse has a legit chance if there is a wicked pace in the Classic.

How is he going to beat second tier grade 1 horses in open company when he cant even beat second tier horses in restricted company?

For the record, there have been some pretty darn good horses that have run in the Cigar over the last few years. You might want to check it out.

I agree, and he's only a length better than LR yesterday, but LR wouldn't have a shot?

Not with the race set up he doesnt have a shot. LR needs to be at or near the front and he isnt going to get there with the speed thats loaded for the classic. Unless you think he will last in a dual with Bernardini, discreet or lava man. Do you really think that?

A horse with tactical speed like SC has a much better shot.

yeah, he beat pv as well..graded winner going into the ark derby, and graded placed since. early book fave for the derby as well...

with a city was a grade 1 winner going into arkansas, died may six.

The difference is that Henny ran a ridiculous fig and also has beaten decent horses in the past. Can you say the same about lawyer Ron?

tossout yesterday? no way...i used him and lawyer ron in the espn contest. shoulda bet it, had another ex as well....

ok, so bernardini and lawyer ron both can claim victories over high cotton...
lol sounds like they've both beat the same horses to me!!

I know who runs in the Cigar Mile. I bet on the race last year...