That is the most funny part of this all. There is very little detriment to the stud value of a colt that gets beat and the whole idea that a filly that gets beat is going to loose breeding value is even more ridiculous. The whole attitude that a loss will hurt you so bad is what is killing the sport. And I'm sure part of it comes from owners moving their horses to a new trainer off a loss. Can you imagine if the Yankees only showed up to games they felt confident they would win cause their prestige would drop with every loss and the manager would be replaced? Baseball would become a joke. But that is essentially what we have in racing today.

I was speaking as far as a career record and accomplishment, but I think you new that before hitting the post button.

Can you imagine if the bears did not show up for the super bowl because they did not like astroturf? (I believe that was John Gaines' original quote, a day for racing that would be like the super bowl).

The last paragraph of the DRF article on the La Derby being lengthened and pushed back was worth noting as well:

"Fair Grounds also has added a new filly-mare dirt stakes, to be run Dec. 19, which comes six weeks after the Nov. 6-7 Breeders' Cup. The 1 1/8-mile race tentatively will be worth $100,000, although Halstrom said the purse could increase substantially if superstars Rachel Alexandra and/or Zenyatta were enticed to run. "It gives all parties involved something to consider and opens the door for further discussions," said Halstrom.

http://drf.com/news/article/106268.html

NT

Yea, I wasnt really responding to your post but using it to make my point. I can understand them wanting to go undefeated and all but what does it really mean when your facing shitty Cal fillies and mares on shitty surfaces. To me her undefeated streak is no more impressive than Peppers Pride's. And as far as the BC goes she beat up on the same shitty horses she had been racing against all year, except for Ginger Punch and a couple others who would of rather sh*t on the SA surface than run on it.

The problem is that people are treating the BC like the Super Bowl. So much so that they aren't showing up for big races the rest of the season. It is more like if the NFL just skipped the regular season and playoffs and just put the top perceived teams in the Super Bowl and made that their season.

i don't know why quality road is thought of as competition-she's decimated the three year old colts, including some that had been highly thought of. i guess since she hasn't faced him, he somehow has achieved some stature....

separate discussion all together

i thought i heard him say she liked del mar...but then, i think the chances of her facing males anywhere is between very, very slim and no chance at all.

i don't think there have been negatives, and i certainly haven't seen any 'trashing' of her anywhere. to trash either of the two is absolutely ridiculous.

no.

but she won't be unbeaten anymore, which is something very rarely done, especially with a top calibre horse. i'd like to see her stay unbeaten and take down the record set by pepper's pride. but she won't run enough more times to do so it seems...

http://www.drf.com/news/article/106245.html


Shirreffs is in no hurry to bring Zenyatta back to the races. He ruled out the Grade 1 Pacific Classic against males here on Sept. 6, meaning Zenyatta will make her next two starts during the Oak Tree meeting at Santa Anita. The first start is obvious - the Grade 1 Lady's Secret Stakes on Oct. 10. Then comes the Breeders' Cup on Nov. 6 and 7. Zenyatta won the BC Ladies' Classic last year, but Shirreffs and owners Jerry and Ann Moss are entertaining thoughts of the Classic, against males.

"We'll wait and see who is running in the Breeders' Cup, what the opposition is, and what's most advantageous," Shirreffs said Monday. "Right now, we just have to be patient."

Those connected with Zenyatta are desirous of a matchup with Rachel Alexandra, the country's best 3-year-old filly. If both continue to win, a race involving those two would undoubtedly determine Horse of the Year. But Jess Jackson, the majority owner of Rachel Alexandra, has stated repeatedly that the Breeders' Cup is out for his filly.

"If they," Shirreffs said, referring to Rachel Alexandra and Zenyatta, "are going to decide Horse of the Year, I would hope it could be settled at the Breeders' Cup. If it isn't, and we think we have the opportunity to win it, then we'll have to go travel after the Breeders' Cup.

"The Breeders' Cup being what it is, that would be a great setting for that decision. That's what the Thoroughbred industry did, create a venue for the best horses in the country, and the world, to come together. Certainly you want to support that."
____________________________

The part in bold is what pisses me off the most about them. They have arguably the best horse in the world and they are going to let others dictate to them where they run? If you have the best horse and you BELIEVE you have the best horse, you say "I'm running here and if you think you can beat me, take your best shot." Not sit back and say "hmm, let me see which race is going to be the toughest one first....and then I'll chose the easiest one." That's complete and total bs. How in the world can you have a horse like Zenyatta and be afraid of ANY challenge? My God.

this is nothing new, frankel made a living on it for 30 years.

well, that is what they say because they are probably pretty sure they would lose to RA on dirt. There is nothing wrong with the consolation prizes they seek, but she'll always retire with that black mark against her in my opinion.

Now, if Rachel isn't entered in races Zenyatta can enter, that is a different story. The BC should not be the be all and end all, and clearly the connections of Rachel Alexandra have mapped out a much more ambitious and demanding year with or without a BC.

Besides, Zenyatta won't win the classic anyway.

I know, you do realize there are many stupid people out there that dont even understand that fact, some in the media even. They think Zenyatta has ducked RA so far.

how does a horse who gets a 99 beyer win the breeders cup classic?

Zenyatta clearly deserves a trainer like Asmussen, thats for certain, and maybe owners like IEAH, they would race her.

It will never happen. If those two meet in the fall, it is going to be in the Falls City Hcp on Thanksgiving weekend.

I think its interesting, but I prefer churchill.

like they do stardom bound? or kip deville, i think they had a three race season in the plans for him last year...:D

Tough comparison as those horses are obviously not themselves anymore.

They really are two old women with self-esteem issues. They don't belong in this sport. Hopefully the next negative article will force them out of the game and the next horse they would of had goes to some connections who like a challenge and who actually care about the competitive and sporting aspect of it.

where is that chicken picture Coach uses?

Hilarious ... dissing Z's connections when crybaby Jackson doesn't want to let his filly join the rest of the racing world at the World Thoroughbred Championships this fall.

Too funny



Z doesn't have to go anywhere ... she's the reigning queen. If they want a piece of the champ they have to come to her house...

That's the type of attitude that's going to cost the queen her throne!

you really think she wont defend her eclipse crown?

Sherriffs and the Moss's are afraid of Rachel...they aren't doing a very good job of hiding from anyone, but then again, they should be scared of Rachel, because Rachel would drown the "so-called" champion mare. But I forgot, Anabaa's Creation, Lethal Heat, and Dawn After Dawn true tests of a Champion. Get a clue.

True but the point was that coming off of the BC win, that's all Kip was planned for. They didn't know how much he'd be in decline now when they planned that light season for him for 2008.

I really don't think enough is being made of the fact that a thread entitled "Zenyetta vs Racheal" has garnered 106 posts.

No, you would think that she's a virtual lock for older female. I'm just talking about public perception. Also if/when Rachael wins Horse of the Year, you would think it would seriously take the air out of the sails of the Zenyatta camp.

with a statement like that, you should get a clue.

IMO she is only a lock if she wins the BC Distaff. her record as of right now.. there are other mare's out there that can compete with that (which is pathetic really)

Who? Seattle Smooth, Seventh Street or Miss Isella? Say what you will about Zenyatta's campaign this year, but neither of these fillies of mares has done enough to dethrone the reigning champ.

i also think zenyatta is a lock for older mare-her carrying 129 a few weeks back to an emphatic victory is her best moment this year. hell, most trainers balk at a colt or older horse carrying that, she did it with ease.

If your goal is to make sure nobody ever takes anything you say seriously ever again, you couldn't dream of doing better than this.

Lol ... how did I miss that gem from kgar311.



LOL … more talented comedians here than on any other horse racing board...

Racing on polysh!t doesn't count for anything...it might as well be turf racing on tires and rubber. You actually think that you have a clue. Maybe if Zenyatta would face some real horses (Rachel Alexandra), we could see what type of a horse she really is, but it's kind of easy beating up on High Priced Claimers in G1s out in Saratoga.

Just face it, Rachel Alexandra is arguably the best horse in training right now considering the dire straits of the pathetic older horse division.

I said to ME ass clown, brush up on your comprehension. Its my opinion. How is hiding in California and going undefeated and not facing any better competition any different then hiding in New Mexico, going undefeated and not facing any better competition. It holds the same merit in my mind. Zenyatta is basically beating non winners and horses that would be 30k claimers in NY by a nose. Until she goes out and finds better competition her undefeated streak means nothing to me.

She did beat up on this one horse named Ginger Punch in Arkansas. You might remember Ginger Punch's name. I think she was the reigning champion older mare. And I'm not sure but I think that Arkansas is not in California. But I'll get back to you on that.

I understand your point and agree with it to an extent but going to ridiculous extremes to try to make it doesn't make any sense.

This Ginger Punch argument is weak. Brownie Points was second. If anyone thinks Brownie Points was better than Ginger Punch overall they're kidding themselves.

The difference is people could ship into California and take her on. Horses couldn't ship in to run in New Mexico restricted races.