So there is no way it is possible that Baffert wanted Gomez to sit there, like Behaving Badly did, right? Come on guys, let's be serious for a second if the hole opens there is no way you are going to convince me that he was going to blow by Songster. You guys are acting like Songster is some pig. He is an improving colt with a big future.

And I suppose if Gomez sends, and he fades in the stretch, then you guys say what a bad ride it was to send. It seems like a lose-lose situation to me.

Bling has BLOWN BY HIM before,and will do so again(when given room to run.)Bling and Anew have just got an extra mid-race burst that most good sprinters can't match.These 2 are the top 2 sprinters in the country.

Too Much Bling was compromised by his post. If he sent into a duel with Fabulous Strike he would have been doomed to lose to Songster who was destined to get a perfect trip due to his luckier draw. The best idea was to let the other one go and hope to either be able to angle out or get enough room to get through. The reality is the hole was tight and the horse, like many, was probably a little chicken about getting through.

Songster and Too Much Bling are both nice horses. One got a predictably better trip than the other in that race and won. On an even playing field the result could easily have been reversed. Blaming a rider in this situation is mystifying as the race basically played out exactly like it looked on paper.

I am not saying it was a great ride, but I don't see what choice Gomez had, and there are certainly FAR better examples of poor rides.

Thank you, that is all I have been trying to say, it was the circumstance not necessarily the ride.

Bling blew by him on a track that Songster seemeds to have a tough time getting a hold of. Still haven't addressed the fact that maybe Baffert told him to sit, you really seem to be avoiding that one. Hmmmm, wonder why.

No, not at all. If he sends and loses, he's not good enough. My only points are these... Pure speed from the rail = must send (not fair to compare Bling to Behaving Badly where BB was FAR superior)... and ... Songster is too good to expect TMB to pass by taking back and going 3-wide.

Songster may still be better. Then again, maybe not. But TMB had no chance after 1/4 IMO. He either needed to be sent hard or it could be that he wasn't good enough to keep up early (hurt?).

Well, if Baffert told him to sit, he didn't sit. He just waited with no place to go. If you're going to sit on a speed horse from the rail, you take back early in order to get your horse in the clear, right?

I truly believe that they decided as a team to sit, because if you notice they have been trying to get TMB to relax a little bit early this year as opposed to last year when it was send, send, send. He rated him in the San Miguel, San Vicente and Bay Shore all to a victory, so obviously Baffert has found a way to get the most out of TMB's speed. I think if you send, you risk getting TMB to revert to his old habit of popping and stopping.

Or come up the rail, if you can't swing out like he did. It just wasn't his day, why is it so crazy to think Songster was just better?

Fair enough. If that's the case, it was a tough go of it! Good luck!

Did Songster run a time like ANEW'S? That's what it would take for me to agree that he was "just better than Bling" that day.That's how good this Bling is.You just don't understand how fast the horse is.Bling can run the 108.10 that ANEW did.Songster ran a 108.88,and that's the difference (about 3-4 lengths,)and that's why Songster just isn't better.You'll see Bling blow by him when they meet again.The question is whether Bling can beat ANEW.

I have been around long enough to know that SCUDS is one of the better handicappers on this board. Easily top 5 IMO.

I think you may be a bit too high on TMB. In his two wins out west this year he beat no one, and he floated over that Aqueduct strip that he obviously loved and Songster didn't take to. I've never been a huge guy on times, because the tracks are all so different now, even day to day, and come on the Belmont strip was lightning fast Belmont day. I'd like to see Anew next time out, because I'm not too sold on him, I think they are all going to need to beat Henny Hughes, because he looks like the real thing, and Afrashad was as impressive, if not more than Anew or anyone that day. What about that speedball? But, again you have shown that you don't get what Baffert was trying to tell EVERYONE, that they are trying to get him to relax, and the rail draw makes that a tough task. So their choice was either to stay with their plan of stalk and pounce, 3 for 3 on the year, or pop and stop like last year.

Scuds,
Man would I hate to be in Kobayashi's bathroom tomorrow morning!!!
Thunder coming! Plenty of wind!
Wonder if it will show up on the weather channel.

True.

If Lezcano was riding him ....

That may be the case, but being a good handicapper doesn't mean you are a good bettor, and TMB was a bad bet. But like most gamblers instead of looking in the mirror, it's easier to blame someone else. Again, why will he not address what has been brought up about Baffert. Baffert is as sharp as they come, and he knew, like I did that there was a strong possibilty this would happen. That's why he thought about scratching. He must've figured they were second best at worst with the projected trip, so maybe they get lucky and the hole opens, if not take the $50,000 for second, and know that you have an explosive sprinter that can be rated.

Ok...let me add this...Scuds is an even better bettor than he is handicapper. I know of noone that has a higher ROI on his bets than he does. THe small amount he puts into tickets and the amount they pay back speak for themselves.

\

That's great, but TMB was a bad bet. Do you disagree?

Well, I was letting this go as a difference of opinion, but it's pretty lame of you to "PROCLAIM" a week later that this horse was a bad bet. How in the world was this so freaking obvious? It's not as if TMB didn't have credentials going in!!!

And, PLEASE stop proclaiming the horse was ridden per Baffert's instructions. TMB was NOT taken back. TMB was NOT sent. TMB WAS RIDDEN LIKE SH1T INTO SURE DEFEAT.

He may not have been good enough. But the ride never gave him any chance to win.

Really pretty classless to keep thumping your tool on the table way after the race when you will not even acknowledge the possibility that the horse may have been poorly ridden.

Sweetness...its very easy to sit back and say that a horse was a bad bet AFTER he loses.

I need something before a race goes off to explain to me why he was a bad bet. I can go back to all the races I lost yesterday, pour over the DRF and find a million reasons why the horses I bet where bad bets AFTER THE FACT.

I don't think he was ridden poorly, and do you think he was a GOOD bet at 6-5. I don't know many GOOD bets at 6-5, so I'll stand with it that he was a bad bet at 6-5. Thats a huge part of handicapping, identifying bad chalk, and this was bad chalk. Do you dispute the fact Baffert has made an attempt to get him to relax. So by sending you risk throwing all of that work away. I'm not proclaiming that I'm so great, just saying instead of deflecting the blame to Gomez, who came through a hole most wouldn't have tried to, maybe take responsibility that he was a bad bet at 6-5.

KOBAYASHI put the fat man away in the final 16th.It just seems that the young man can raise his game to match any competition.Makes you wonder if he will ever be beaten in this Championship. A true star in the food -eatin' competitions.DTS,He probably does have a bathroom with a T.V. built into the wall. This is a star,and a true food eatin' star has access to these amenities.

He was a bad bet before the race too. Before the race, he was breaking from the rail, which is a tough post going 7 furlongs, I think there is no disputing that, like the outside post is going 1 1/8 at Saratoga. Baffert seemed troubled by the post, and you know how confident Baffert usually is, and he was 6-5. What more do you want me to say, do you like betting 6-5's with tough posts, because I sure don't. Especially in a tough field.

1. I didn't bet the race
2. You're wrong to proclaim the horse was ridden "perfectly according to instructions."
3. You're wrong about Baffert. If he really didn't like the post, he could have scratched instead of risking "all his work"
3. 6/5 is a FREAKING GREAT PRICE if you make the horse 1/2. AS freaking great a handicapper you are, you should know that.
4. IT's freaking tasteless to proclaim a horse that lost a bad bet weeks later. Next time, try doing it before the race, huh?
5. Whatever. Tired of you tossing out the same ****ing **** over and over.

You are the ****ing greatest.

There you go. That and $2 gets you a Coke and Twinkie.

Ditto....:cool:

This is hard to say,because you're not saying what bet? Do I think any horse is worth putting hundreds or thousands on to win?(at 6/5 or less)..No,but I try to only bet multi-race stuff,and so it's a matter of getting through a race,and less a matter of win odds.It comes down to using the horse with the most ability(not necessarily the best value in the win pool.)This is the nice thing about the multi-race bets(you don't drive yourself nuts trying to get the extra buck or 2 in value...you just play the animals that you like.)

Thank you, because that's what i was looking for. Stop being babies, the post started about jockey's and got to this because I didn't think Gomez rode a bad race. The fact that he was a bad bet came up because I was trying to make the point that SCUDS should be mad at himself, not Gomez, this was after being called stupid, or something to that degree. I never said the horse was ridden perfectly and do you dispute the fact Baffert was visibly upset before the race about the post. He did think about scratching, look it up. And if you make that horse 1/2, why didn't you bet him at a "generous" 6/5. And can you honestly say with a straight face that TMB was a great price at 6/5? If so, plesae give us more great 6/5 shots, because I can't wait to sh*t on them too.

Hey, I'm totally with you there I like the multi race stuff also. I just think you always have to look at value, and TMB at such a short price is no value, considering the makeup of the race.

I had Jazil singled.That was my value.After that,I just needed to get through races.He(Bling) was a poor win bet(if that's what your asking,but I wouldn't think there are very many good win bets at 6/5 or less.)

Nice pick on Jazil, he was great value. I'm with you, there aren't many good win bets at those odds.

Go **** Yourself.

I did not bet the race.

I didn't care for the ****ing race. I did not think ANY horse was worth betting there.

If you think Songster was great value there at 8/5 in a short field , you're either a ****ing idiot or a ****ing genius. I'm nit sure which.

**** you with your diagnosis of Baffert. Now you are Dr. ****ing Phil?

Go take a look at your July 4 "Picks" thread. I just took a sh1t on your 4th race,

First off Einstein, Songster was 5/2 and paid $7.70, which is a little different than 8/5, but I'm sure you knew that even a ****ing idiot knows that, right? Is my opinion about what Baffert thought that far fetched, I don't think so. You did get me at Belmont, that's okay, I'll live to bet another race, and not dwell and whine and complain about it for weeks after.

Good for you. Yeah, sure you're right. Baffert told the jock, "Don't send. Don't take back. Just sit 1/2 length off the pace on the inside as long as you can and see what happens." Whatever, I could not give a sh1t.

Go **** yourself anyway. Aside from that, good luck.

Thank you I think I will go do that. Happy 4th of July, keep those insightful, witty and dead on posts coming okay. Must be frustrating to be wrong on so many fronts.

Another genius who has graced us with his presence Stud. For the record I used both in pik-4's(which I hit and was very big) and rooted for Songster at the longer price and was quite pleased when Gomez gave a moronic ride. Hows that you genius? I made more money on the deal but I'm sure not gonna sit here and redboard that I just know that Gomez was gonna give a ridiculouslt stupid ride. Can you watch a race? Apparaently not, I got lucky to get the better priced horse home, a blind man could see that GG was incredibly incompetent and stupid with that ride. I echo Studs sentiments, go **** yourself but please have a happy and safe 4th of July!!! best wishes to you and yours!!

Great for you, who gives a sh*t.

disagree...she wasn't tired.....He saw the whip and shyed away from it becuase she didn't want to get cracked by it

Scav,
There are muliple threads going on in this one..hot dog eating (where I was trying to be funny)...jocks (notice I haven't given an opinion)...
but what you said about crackin' a 2yo is very true.
I didn't see the race in question.
From what I do know, that's one of the quickest ways to ruin a good prospect. Would you want to leave your stall and lead out so that you could have your butt beaten? It's called "operant conditioning". The babies get to associate running with punishment.
It's ruined many good ones.
Some are in this business despite their ignorance.
DTS

Well,we don't have to go very far to find the example of what I wanted from Gomez on Bling.For that matter,we don't have to go very far to see what Baffert wanted from Gomez on Bling.Today,E Z Warrior won the Hollywood Juvenile Championship FROM THE 1 HOLE. Baffert said HE ALMOST SCRATCHED DUE TO THE 1 HOLE,but he and the owner decided he was good enough to overcome it.Watch the race.This is the way I wanted Gomez to get him off the rail.Even Flores can do it.This is all after E Z Warrior won his 1st race from the 1 hole.So,Baffert just hates the one hole,and is gunna blame that for any loss his horses have from that post.That would be why he didn't criticize the ride by Gomez(he assumes he will get beat from the 1 hole,and is pleasantly surprised if he wins from it.)Baffert thought Bling(with Gomez up)could win from the 1 hole,or he wouldn't have run him.