LOL @ the hypocrisy of that.

It's in the books, but you want to know which one was "better"?

I think this is a much more interesting and productive thread, as "Who was closer to the TC?" is easier to define and less subjective than "Who was better?" Besides, we already have enough "Who's better than who" threads around here and they get nowhere.

to quote Ed Vedder,
nothing has changed but the surrounding bull sh*t, that has grown.




Repent

cant back what up?
that The Stone was better?
you are just p*sed b/c I can back that up.

almost every historically significant horse has won at Belmont Racetrack.
when did smarty jones do that?
the Stone did it, and more than once.

The Stone beat him when they met on a dry track.
the Stone went on to win the Travers, which is our country's best measuring stick of top class 3YOs.
look at the past winners.
the Travers winners are as impressive of a group as any 3YO race run in this country.
you can say that lucky jones was better.
hell, you can even believe it if you want to.
but the record shows us that The Stone beat him the last time they met and the one time they met on a dry track.
and from a historical perspective, its not even close.
The Stone rules over lucky jones.



Repent

Afleet Alex was closer to winning the triple crown. If Jeremy Rose hadn't moved him to the *dead* Churchill rail, he probably would have won the Derby. He was much the best that day. I think he could have held off Giacomo closing on the outside. I like Giacomo, but I do think that on that day, Afleet Alex was the much better horse,,,just had ****ty racing luck. Which we all know is a huge part of the game.

Now, that being said, I think Smarty was a better horse. He was more deserving of the Triple Crown, but, the way the race set up, there was just NO WAY he beats Birdstone that day. Like many, I think it was because of the way he was double-teamed,,,,but I really can't take anything away from Birdstone on that day. And double-teaming is legal, just like running rabbits. I STILL cry big ole crocodile tears when I watch that Belmont replay. Actually, I have a real hard time watching it. Broke my heart!!

Suzanne

Easily Smarty. I don't think that Alex was the best horse in his loss. I thought Smarty was. I don't think it's even close. I felt that Smarty was 3x the horse Alex was, maybe more.

you are a freaking moron.

the Travers track was listed as "fast".
the rain came after the race that day.

but Im not even sayng The Stone hated an off track.
what I am saying is that the one time they met on a dry track, The Stone beat him.
new to the sport?
maybe, depends on perspective.
but the verification of your expertise relies on someone else, anyone else, agreeing with your opinion.
what the hell kind of sense does that make.
I oay the b*tch next door to say that Birdstone was a better horse.
that does not make it any more true or false.

and you want me to find a "credible" person to say that Birdstone was not the recipient of a "dream trip"?
what makes someone credible and what encompasses a dream trip?
does someone on this board with x amount of posts make them credible?
do they need to be a full time writer with the Daily Racing Form?
or can they be a degenerate at Manor Downs that i see when I stop by to pick up a form?


your position is full of holes and all the smarty party agreeing with you will not make it any stronger.

Birdstone got the right pace scenario he needed to be most effective on Belmont Stakes day.
so what?
it does not make his win any less valid than if smarty jones had won the race while getting an easy lead.

stop worrying about my experience within the game or my historical perspective.
they are not relevant to the argument at hand.

like I said, nothing has changed but the surrounding bullsh*t that has grown.
Ed was right on point with that one.



Repent

good gosh,
this is like conversing with Richi.

when this dude cant strengthen his argument any further,
he starts attaking the opposition's percieved experience or status within the game of horse racing.

what a bunch of crap.

Im a mid 20s businessman with a full time addiction to horse racing.
I love it. It consumes almost all my free time.
Im not an expert and would never pretend to be.
but I do my homework. I dont present false data and I dont assume my conclusions to be facts.

hey btw, DaHoss sucked as a racehorse.



Repent

ok DaHoss,
im out of here.
please respond with some more posts concerning my experience within the game in order to strengthen your argument for smarty jones.

cant wait to read it when I get back.
later on loser.


Repent

Ateam,
I meant that some posters on me have attacked me for posting things like this question. Speculation on thing that haven't happened and things like that. Responses like NorthCarolinaTon'ys are what I mean. He's actually polite about it. A lot fo people have literally "snapped on me" for it... That's all I meant. I think it's a good topic and worth talking about too.

'Pent, of course it's not provable. And techinically nothing illegal wss done. But if anyone wanted to see Smarty fail, It was Bailey. For all the reasons listed above, not for just for the reason of "winning a race".

I am not trying to refute what you said or argue with you. I have only one point to make. I was at the Travers in 2004. It started raining about twenty minutes before the Travers; my husband and I were caught in the deluge as we walked to the track. We needed a row boat to navigate. I think the race was even run several minutes early, so we could not bet! We had just gotten to the track as it was being run. I had bet Birdstone in the Belmont, so I was going to put him in some big exactas. Anyway, my only point is that track seemed very off, so Birdstone won on a pea soup track that day.

OK, for starters: DA HOSS WAS AN AWESOME RACE HORSE REPENT. GO WATCH HIS 2ND BC WIN. :mad: You shouldn't say things like that.

As for the topic of this thread: I would have to give the nod to Alex. I like both horses. I really do. I liked Smarty's story and the horse himself. You all blame RH10 and Eddington for the loss of his triple crown. One thing I bring up in defense of Alex: Scrappy T.

It really is silly to debate this topic. It really comes down to people's opinions on who impressed them more as a racer. Both horses were awesome and they had a great triple crown run. Lets leave it at that and not bash each other.

Not sure what Scrappy T has to do with AA losing the Triple Crown, he didn't run in the Derby and despite the bad trip AA beat him in the Preakness....


I would think RHT and Eddington are better horses than Scrappy T...

In my opinion Smarty was a better horse, but there's no arguing this with Repent. Why can't he just take this hatred to a horse that deserves it like Bernardini...

Why does Bernardini deserve hatred?

It amazes me how anyone can hate a horse that is the best horse to come around in a very, very long time...

H e l l, it amazes me how anyone can hate ANY horse if they love this sport. These horses die for us!

Good question... :confused:

Also, for the record, I agree with Cardus. Smarty Jones actually had a triple crown run since he won the Kentucky Derby... Alex didn't even have a shot... you gotta win the first one to be considered a triple crown candidate.

Too many people are as Bold would say goo-goo and just flat out rediculous about the horse, he's very good, probably the best in training, but not what all of the goo-goo's make him out to be...I am sick of hearing about him, Repent could bring these people the pain they need to zap them back to reality...