What was wrong with last year's field? You had the second and third place Derby horses in Bluegrass Cat and Steppenwolfer, other graded stakes winners in Bob and John, Deputy Glitters, and Sunriver, and stakes performers in Hemingway's Key, Sacred Light, and Platinum Couple. That's a legit 3YO GI field IMO.

JJP,

Multiple horses were eligible for N1X in the 2000 Belmont, including the favorite Aptitude. Toss in Wheelaway, Commendable, I think, and a few others. Unshaded wasn't because of the Lexington, Hugh Hefner wasn't because of a Cal-bred win, and I can't remember who else was in the field. I know I was six deep in the Pick 6 but I wouldn't have ever used Commendable.

NT

I don't agree with the second paragraph, but definitely agree with the latter. Afleet Alex looked flat to me coming down the stretch in the Derby so I don't really agree with him being 5 lengths better on that day, but any other day, yes.

I disagree, I think they run it 5 times and Jazil runs right around the exact same time every race. He just runs the same speed all the time. I don't think that in 4 out of 5 races someone else from that field would run significantly better to beat him. At 12 furlongs he might even crack the top five horses in the country last year behind Invasor, Barbaro, Bernardini, and Premium Tap who all likely would have gone 12 no problem. None of the other horses in that Belmont field are even close to cracking the top ten. Unfortunately for Jazil there are no more 12 furlong races to run in so he'll be deemed a slow failure for not being able to win major stakes at 9 furlongs.

That rail was as dead as dead could be that. Alex was obviously spent, lugged in to the worst part of the track, and spun his wheels. The most impressive horse in that race, IMO, was Closing Argument.

I agree on that. An amazing race by him that day.

Caveat to my previous statement: Afleet Alex ran a damn good race in Derby 131 as well. He took all sorts of bumping in the first half mile or so, and still was there at the finish. Closing Argument and Afleet Alex basically had the same trip in that race.

Way off topic.

this is a great thread. i have never been a big fan of jazil, but when somebody comes on here that clearly does not understand the meaning of the word "overrated" i like the fact that a bunch of different people shout him down.
the most overrated horse ever? you have to be kidding me. he was not even the most overrated horse to win a TC race last year.....let alone ever. it was a foolish comment. thanks for setting him straight guys.

I almost got attacked by Baffert that day after I told him Bob and John would need a golf cart to win the Derby!!! :P

The golf cart would beat him in a match race. :D Just kidding!

You're correct in this except that Cal-bred wins don't count against OPEN N1X conditions... so technically, Hugh Hefner was also eligible for N1X.

I liked the Superstar a lot better than Bob and John after that race... especially when I had the unfortunate luck of sitting next to Bob and John themselves... all i could think the whole time was "what does baffert put in his hair that makes it so shiny??" :p

That's correct Phil, hey what do you think of Panty Raid today? She should destroy them at about 2/5 in my opinion.

NT

Watch out for Early Vintage.

In Eclipse balloting, the Belmont winner Jazil was not even rated in the top three. I do not see him as overhyped or overrated at all. He reminds me of another TC race winner named Strike the Gold. After his Derby victory, he went thirteen months until he found the winner's circle again in the Pimlico Special, the same day that his future nemesis A.P. Indy won the Belmont. In the 1992 BC Classic, Strike the Gold could not handle the younger, better horse. I would think Jazil will repeat that. Better younger horses will defeat him in the fall. Before that his own age group will defeat him.

I wonder if he steals Jill's products? :cool: (this smilie actually resembles him)

The "Bob" in Bob and John is not Bob Baffert. It is rather Bob McNair, the owner of Stonerside Stable. The "John" of Bob and John is John Adger, racing manager for Stonerside's racing and breeding operation. I'm sure Baffert would like to think the Bob was meant to be for him, but it was not.

NT

i'll guess she goes off at 9/5 or so. this is a pretty decent N1X, i'd be afraid of Silver Knockers. Sniper likes Early Vintage...

I wouldn't be surprised if she runs well today but gets beat. First start off a 7 month layoff, and there's bigger prizes down the road for a filly that could potentially be the best of her birthyear (and i mean that legitimately.)

Thats my opinion. Not necessarily over rated but do not believe future will have him winning many G1's. Think he is a tough little horse but do not like him from wagering standpoint or believe he will be a major factor rest of handicap division season. Did make an OK run to be second to Take the Bluff who did repeat yesterday albeit in a three horse field so not sure how much I would put into that. Still agree that he wont win much untill fall and there is a good chance a few 3 year olds will devlop to be better than him come fall championship season

Correct... Bob McNair was at Aqueduct with Baffert on Wood day. I didn't know what the other guy looked like but i'd guess that he was in that group.

HAHAHA!

Gotta go with Awsugahnow... what a great name. LOL :D

The sex-laden box of Panty Raid, Silver Knockers, and Awsugahnow it is! :D

Yeah, but it might take a nice Early Vintage for them to lose their knockers. :D

HEY NO STEALING MY TRI BOX! :D

Actually, I picked Awsugahnow to win.

wanna overrated horse? empire faker! luckily for him somehow pat day manages a 4 wide trip in a compact field and loses a ton of ground or else TMW rolls right by him that day. saarland being 5-1 in the derby was an absolute joke as well

i hope panty raid does well, got some sentimental feeling with the owners since they bred my horse(glencrest farm)

OMG, that is hilarious... :eek: :D

Agreed. Was at Spa for that years Jim Dandy. Lucky enough to get box seat. Not taking anything away from Strong Hope but he had length of stretch to run SH down and EM could not. Hung again. That of course was last we saw of him. Horse had talent but not to level of aura surrounding him

You wanna argue about Empire Maker again? You are soooooo silly. :)

he was overrated, he got beat by man among men lololololol...............nuff said. if atswhatimtalkinbout doesnt get a absolute butcher job of a ride by flores he clearly gets second in that years derby as opposed to only gettin beat a head by the faker, he may have won it all

don't you mean "Place their Panties [on the floor] and Show their Knockers"? :p

There is no 22-change pace in this race, which further complicates Jazil. Corinthian is off the lay-off, so you have play against him too. DOC CHENEY might be a bit slow in figs, but he at least has some tactical speed. KING OF JAZZ worthy of improvement... tough call there though.

Good call. Saarland had to be one of the most overrated. Dollar Bill also. Somebody earlier mentioned Jazil reminded them of Strike the Gold. StG didn't need 12 furlongs to find a field he could beat. Nowadays the quality in the Belmont fields pales in comparison to the Derby. And it should; 12 furlings is an irrelevant distance for dirt racing.

And that's a shame IMO. I have huge respect for the kinds of horses that are bred to go long... I'm sick of seeing the sprinter types all over the place. If we want our sport to be devoted to sprinting, perhaps we should start betting quarter horses.

Agree Travis. Posted that a little earlier. King of Jazz might be tough

Not sure if the link will work but here is the chart from her first start:

http://www.equibase.com/premium/eqbP...&BUILD_CACHE=N

Inside post in a big field and she managed to rate, avoid problems and draw off to win. The fact that the second and third place finishers in that race are 9/5 and 8/1 in the Silverbulletday makes it all the more impressive. I'll be amazed if she goes off at 8-1.

I was the person who mentioned Strike the Gold. I agree with you. STG could win in under 12 furlongs!

In Eclipse balloting, the Belmont winner Jazil was not even rated in the top three.

Rightfully so!

I wouldnt give much credit to Take the Bluff's victory. He sat a perfect trip behind a horse who should never be on the lead to begin with- Executive Choice. And he was all out to hold off the mighty Thundering Success, in a
3 horse field.

And I dont consider Bob & John any better a horse then Scrappy T and a few others who ran behind Afleet Alex in the 05 Belmont.

Even Scrappy T wasn't in that field. That stellar field was comprised of:
Andromeda's Hero
Nolan's Cat
Indy Storm
AP Arrow
Chekhov
Giacomo
Southern Africa
Watchmon
Reverberate
Pinpoint

That being said Alex won that race incredibly easily and likely could have made an early move and blown them away if they were concerned with putting up a good time. As it was it was still 14 lengths back to the 3rd place finisher.