Shoot... ten bucks? I'll take it! :D

I'll be willing to eat crow if need be and I'm good on my word.

cool! I like to make friendly wagers small... if i would have said 1,000 dollars you would have said to **** off (that and I would not risk anything over 100 cause I am young and nervous when it comes to gambling)... but now I'll be able to buy a few beers after breeders cup on you!!! (JK, let the best horse win!)

I do not understand the anti-Gulfstream venom. Wasn't it about 100 degrees at Santa Anita in 2003?:confused:

yea and the Euros dominated turf. Then again it was the hottest year in history for the Froggies.

My favorite wagering Breeders Cups have been at Belmont and Churchill. I think they are exceedingly fair tracks with little excuses for the horses. Monmouth, by the way, with the changes in track configuration will be better than people think. The turf course there now will be extremely solid for a Breeders Cup.

Ellis Park!!!!

Too bad Hialeah isn't in existence for racing anymore.There was never a better turf course in the United States and the main track was equally as good.That facility would have had no problem handling that amount of people.The only drawback is the neighborhood,but then again Belmont is not exactly in paradise and either is Hollywood.

Listen Hialeahs area is terrible.My point was that Hepstead turnpike before you hit the Nassau county border is not heaven.When i've spent a day at JFK seeing clients i take Springfield boulevard home until i get too Jamaica Ave. and go right to our house in Little Neck.I'm sure you'd agree that Aqueduct is not in the greatest area either.

The Breeders Cup shouldn't just be held in the United States. They can't call it the "World Championship" if they always hold it here. It should be held at the tracks in Europe too. Or Asia.

If they don't have a dirt facility then they should co-op with tracks that do like NAS, or CD, or BEL.

It's a joke to see the Euros come over and try to compete on our 7 furlong turf courses. And it's even more of a joke when they beat the pants off us!

Woodbine might be a good facility for it also.

Hialeah Park is / was nothing but a toilet. Thank god they closed that g_d forsaken place. I hope you were referring to 30 years ago, as the last 5-7years before it was closed it was by far the worst track I have ever been too. I have been to Belmont and it is like being in Paradise compared to Hialeah. You must have went to Hialeah when KC and the Sunshine Band was playing for free.

I think they should rotate through Woodbine once in a while. The facility is very nice and the turf course is excellent.

I like it to be more global. Have it at Churchill and Belmont and then every 5th year have it in Europe if they could find a place with a good enough dirt surface.

Well i guess i am giving a way my age.I was there in the 80's and early 90's.Let's not forget that the track to be during the 50's and 60's was not Belmont or any California track but it was Hialeah.The facility is enormous.I live here in NY and let me tell you that there was never a better turf course than Hialeahs.It really happens to se a shame what the oucome became of that place.

I hate to say this because its not fair to other big venues - but I agree whole-heartedly.....

Belmont, Churchill and Arlington are the ONLY tracks this time of year that offer everything important to host a successful BC IMO......I'd have to type more than I want to to list the reasons.....

I guess if having freezing temperatures and sloppy tracks are the only things that are important.

THATS MY BOY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What about Del Mar, and I agree with Zaf... Woodbine would be a nice place too. **** your guys' opinions on Polytrack courses. Keneland does suck right now with the huge closing bias, but like Turfway it'll get tweaked to be more fair. I'll take it all back if adjustments are made and the bias still exists. But this is a "Guinea Pig" year for Keeneland just like it was at Turfway last year. The same for Woodbine and Holywood. They'll be making adjustments for a year or two after installation and races. I'm totally with you guys right now. The stuff blows. But I wanna be optimisitc, and at least give tracks a chance to try and get things more blanaced out there. Lash out at me if you want, but I'm gonna let time dictate my final opinion.

But I mean those places only as alternates as NY, CD, Arlington, and Insert one of the 3 Big So-Cal tracks for the next year. Then from there maybe mix in a Woodbine or Del Mar or Gulfstream or the 'Stizzy again.

Arlington has to be used on a consistent basis in that rotation. It is generally a very fair race track. In '02, it was drying out which I believe made it the speed favoring surface it was that day. The Europeans love the turf course at Arlington (it's one-mile) as exemplified from their consistent trips over for Million Day. Most importantly, Chicago is a top 3 market in this country. The only problem is whether to push the Juvenile races to 9 furlongs or drop it down to a one-turn 8. For me personally, I like the fact that very FEW horses have a race over the surface. It can make it tougher to handicap, but as a fan I see that it levels the playing field. Practically 90% of the horses have to ship. Others have repeatedly said that Arlington is the nicest racing facility in the country as well.

The way I see it, if you're going to give it to New York horsemen every three years, you have to do the same for the California horsemen and give them the same advantage just as often. Not to mention, the weather is generally better in California than New York at that time of year. Don't let the '03 heat wave scare you off. The Euros don't mind; they only won 2.5 of 3 turf races last time including a clean sweep of the F&MT. So, it should be:

Churchill
New York
Arlington
California
"Wild Card" - Florida, Canada, Louisiana (you know Fairgrounds is making a bid soon to help "rebuild"), etc.
REPEAT CYCLE

-Ryan

There has been some mention of holding the Breeders' Cup in Europe every few years. I wouldn't be in support of that idea, especially with Arc day providing all that's needed nowadays, and on a proper turf course.
However I think calling the BC the "World Thoroughbred Championships" reeks a little bit of self grandiloquence. When you consider that 19 countries were represented at the Carnival in Dubai last season it seems a bit ridiculous to name the BC in these terms when I would imagine no more than 6 or 7 countries were represented by runners in 2005.

I can understand the dislike of Cali tracks, but would like the opportunity to witness one in the future. No Europe-No way! Where ever it is held- I JUST DONT WANT IT TO RAIN! There...I feel better

toga.......

Toga's kinda cold at the end of October Hooves, and the place is not a heated facility. Be kinda rough.
Belmont and CD are the only way to go. I don't see why it needs to be a traveling carnival act. Both CD and Belmont are big places near airports and quarantine facilities with plenty of hotels nearby. Both have grass and dirt facilities that are fair to Euros, East and West Coast horses.
I really gotta say that CD and Bel should be the only two places that host it.

i know it wont happen..just like the whole layout...is gonna be cold in ky too..and the arlington bc was frigging freezing...so too was belmont last year..gulfstream..or make that un used track in fla that starts with a h a home of the bc..its not cold ,,,

The area for Hialeah is bad. I LOVED the track though. I LOVED watching the flaminos fly! It really was a beautiful track. No I didn't like the neighborhood though, but I agree with you hooves. Why shouldn't it be held in a warm climate? It is in the high 80s/low 90s right now.

I agree with having it at least once at Saratoga. The place more so than any other track deserves it. I don't buy into the weather argument. Belmont can get cold, they held it at Woodbine in Canada for god's sakes and in Arlington Park. The place is large enough to accomadate the people. Between Albany and Lake George there are more than enough hotels. I know in the past The NTRA has contacted NYRA about it but NYRA used the excuse of the weather and accomadations, which is pure and utter BS. The only reason they don't is because Belmont and Saratoga share the "guts" and it is a major overhaul to do for just one day.
Now I am not saying having it on a regular rotation but just once, just once have it at the place that was the birthplace of "organized" horse racing in our country. It's the olderst race track still running and the place has played host to some of the most treasured moments in horse racing. It would be such an event and spectacle that every horse fan would want to be a part of. It would have a similiar effect to when the All-Star game was held at Fenway. It is a perfect analogy, The place is tiny but them made it work. And it was great for baseball. If they can pull it off there, they can sacrafice the overhaul from Belmont to Saratoga JUST ONCE!!!!!!

I just started this thread Scavs. And for once Jerry might have a vaild point.

Man look at that track. I miss it. (where's the tear drop icon) Actually it looks like it could had use more dirt that day. Kind of looks like a paved highway.

YES! YES! BRING IT HERE!

There are rarely freezing temperatures at Churchill or Belmont in early November. Monmouth fits that description, too. I would not vouch for the Windy City track, however.

I like the suggestion of having it every year at a revamped Hialeah
great park, great fall temps

wasnt Hialeah the track they used for Let it Ride

Says it was filmed in Hialeah, Florida, so I am guessing you are correct. :)

obviously the notion of it only being at two tracks won't ever happen -- but leaving arlington out would be a bad idea. it's arguably the most beautiful, nicest racing facility in the country and the track never plays anything but fair.

Seattle Slew established the seven furlong record at Hialeah in 1977. The record never fell, even though myriad top horses ran there.:cool:

Wasn't there a big speed bias the last time it was at AP?

I like the fact that the Juvenile was run at nine furlongs at Arlington.:)

I don't think that there was a speed bias at all.

Azeri won on the front end, but was a far superior animal.
Vindication won near the front end, but was a far superior animal.
Storm Flag Flying got passed in the stretch and came back.
Volponi came from off the pace when some great horses were on the front end.

It seemed pretty fair, but also if you still say there was a speed bias, I would just point out that any track can appear to have a "bias" on any day. All frontrunners could win on the dirt all day at Belmont some day but we wouldn't say it is an unfair track.

By and large, all summer long, Arlington plays extremely fair throughout the whole meet.

Okay, I couldn't remember...

When I think of great places to see races, I think of Belmont or Churchill, I just don't think of AP... I have heard it's nice, but I think those two should be the only ones where the BC's are held every year, the BC's are the best when had at one of those two venues...