Derby Trail Forums

Derby Trail Forums (http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/index.php)
-   Sports Bar & Grill (http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=7)
-   -   UConn Women Vs. UCLA (http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/showthread.php?t=40109)

MaTH716 12-23-2010 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slewbopper (Post 736160)
There is an age limit of 22 for entering the WNBA, the same as there was in the NBA years ago. Remember Wilt jumping to the Globe Trotters from Kansas after his junior season? The exceptions to the rule are the player has completed 4 years of college or is not an American. Underage foreigners can play in the W but few do because as you said, there is just no money here. Diana Taurasi and a few other American gals are making $1 mil a season playing in Russia during the winter. There is also good money to be made in Spain, Turkey, and Israel. Weird, eh? Then they play in the W in the summer under a salary cap that only allows salaries of $40,000 to $100,000 a season.

I find that amazing that there is such a market for them overseas.
Makes you think, why even play for 100k during the summer and jepordize your 7 digit paydays in the winter.

randallscott35 12-23-2010 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaTH716 (Post 736161)
I find that amazing that there is such a market for them overseas.
Makes you think, why even play for 100k during the summer and jepordize your 7 digit paydays in the winter.

For da love of the game

Slewbopper 12-23-2010 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by randallscott35 (Post 736162)
For da love of the game

Exactly...A W championship means much more to them than one in Russia or Spain.

Dahoss 12-23-2010 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slewbopper (Post 736118)
Prior to the '08-'09 season, UConn signed the #1 HS player in the country, a 6'5 guard named Elena Della Donne. She is probably the greatest pure shooter in the history of the women's game. She attended a pre-season two week get together in June when the team held voluntary uncoached scrimmages and practices. She packed her bags and went home to Delaware after two days. She knew at the time she would be unable to give the intensity needed to play at UConn. In August, she officially left UConn and enrolled at Delaware. She is now playing there in obscurity with little chance of ever making it to the NCAA tournament, and if she does it will be as a 13 to 16 seed. We certainly haven't missed her.

I saw something about her on ESPN. Didn't she leave because she was essentially burnt out and didn't return to basketball for 2 years?

Slewbopper 12-23-2010 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dahoss (Post 736173)
I saw something about her on ESPN. Didn't she leave because she was essentially burnt out and didn't return to basketball for 2 years?

Yes. Her family is filthy rich and she had been pushed by her "stage dad" father. She had a personal trainer at age 8. T%he one thing that she never was taught is work ethic. She relies totally on her shooting ability and ball handling skills. As a freshman at Delaware, she played volleyball. She is now a redshirt soph for basketball.

I went to see her at Yale a month ago. She rarely runs, and never all out. She trots. She does not rebound much despite being the tallest player on the team. She scored 40 against Yale but was gassed at every time out. She saw the writing on the wall when she visited UConn. She was unwilling to put in the necessary work to play at UConn's level. She would have spent her career in Geno's doghouse

She prefers being the big fish in the little pond

Dahoss 12-23-2010 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slewbopper (Post 736178)
Yes. Her family is filthy rich and she had been pushed by her "stage dad" father. She had a personal trainer at age 8. T%he one thing that she never was taught is work ethic. She relies totally on her shooting ability and ball handling skills. As a freshman at Delaware, she played volleyball. She is now a redshirt soph for basketball.

I went to see her at Yale a month ago. She rarely runs, and never all out. She trots. She does not rebound much despite being the tallest player on the team. She scored 40 against Yale but was gassed at every time out. She saw the writing on the wall when she visited UConn. She was unwilling to put in the necessary work to play at UConn's level. She would have spent her career in Geno's doghouse

I guess my point was not playing for more than 2 years sort of implies she really was burnt out and not just not wanting to put in the necessary work. Not the first time we've seen a parent ruin a sport for their child.

horseofcourse 12-23-2010 03:37 PM

I came across this...was this just a family excuse for the situation??

It turns out, though, that Delle Donne’s biggest reason for returning to Delaware emerged: She really missed her sister Lizzie. Lizzie was born blind, deaf and with cerebral palsy, and she and Elena have a tremendous bond.

For me, that would be a tough situation to deal with, being as physically gifted as she is and having to witness the complete opposite in her sister every day of her life. I'd feel some guilt. This thread is the first time I have ever heard of this Delle Donne girl.

GPK 12-23-2010 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaTH716 (Post 736156)
Let's be honest, they stayed in school for all four years because there is no money to be made in the WNBA. If the WNBA pay scale was 1/3rd of what the NBA is, I would think that there would be very little chance that many of these girls would be there for all 4 years.

I understand what you are saying, but you are obviously vested/genuinely interested in the program as you attended college and from the sounds of it live in the area/state.

As a sports fan from a nearby state, I could honestly say I just don't find women's basketball interesting. They could win 1000 in a row and while I acknowledge that it's an accomplishment, I honestly couldn't care less. I just don't find the sport interesting.

I do enjoy certain womans sports, just basketball isn't one of them.

Women's Beach Volleyball has a tendency to capture my attention.

blackthroatedwind 12-23-2010 05:09 PM

I actually think the two streaks are extremely comparable. I wonder what the lines were in the VAST majority of UCLA's games. I bet the competitive level was shockingly similar. Division I men's hoop was a LOT different back then and UCLA was absolutely stacked. No doubt UConn has a similar competitive advantage, though many women's programs have gotten much stronger since Diana and Sue were playing there.

It's an amazing achievement and I bet Bill Walton would agree with me.

Slewbopper 12-23-2010 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by horseofcourse (Post 736208)
I came across this...was this just a family excuse for the situation??
It turns out, though, that Delle Donne’s biggest reason for returning to Delaware emerged: She really missed her sister Lizzie. Lizzie was born blind, deaf and with cerebral palsy, and she and Elena have a tremendous bond.

For me, that would be a tough situation to deal with, being as physically gifted as she is and having to witness the complete opposite in her sister every day of her life. I'd feel some guilt. This thread is the first time I have ever heard of this Delle Donne girl.

Not an excuse at all. During the reruiting process, UConn, Villanova , and Tennessee were the frontrunners. I always thought she would go to Villanova for a nuimber of reasons. It was 30 miles from home. They run a Princeton style offense which is basically slow down basketball that depends heavily on three point shots.....perfect for her

By chosing UConn which I am sure was Daddy Dearest's choice she put herself in a position due to a special Big East rule to never be able to play the sport she signed a letter of intent for at any other Big East school.

This is all a smoke sdcreen....of course I have a biased opinion
http://www.usatoday.com/video/index....nt/51404007001

clyde 12-23-2010 05:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slewbopper (Post 736233)
Not an excuse at all. During the reruiting process, UConn, Villanova , and Tennessee were the frontrunners. I always thought she would go to Villanova for a nuimber of reasons. It was 30 miles from home. They run a Princeton style offense which is basically slow down basketball that depends heavily on three point shots.....perfect for her

By chosing UConn which I am sure was Daddy Dearest's choice she put herself in a position due to a special Big East rule to never be able to play the sport she signed a letter of intent for at any other Big East school.

This is all a smoke sdcreen....of course I have a biased opinion
http://www.usatoday.com/video/index....nt/51404007001


Biased--maybe.

Stupid--of course.

Coach Pants 12-23-2010 05:48 PM

STOP IT!!





























Well I heard from a buddy of mine that her dad was very fond of Geno...if you know what I am saying. *nudge nudge*

I R INSIDER

clyde 12-23-2010 06:04 PM

!!

MaTH716 12-23-2010 10:32 PM

Just saw this and it made me think of this thread.

http://sports.espn.go.com/wnba/news/story?id=5952813

Cannon Shell 12-23-2010 11:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slewbopper (Post 736118)
This is simply not true, at least not this year. Maya was the #1 highschooler in the country as a junior and senior. Of the rest of the roster, none were ranked higher than #10. Other programs (Tennessee, Duke, UNC) are more "stacked" according to HS rankings. Tennessee presently has a roster of at least 6 players that were ranked in the top 10 in HS. Why haven't they even been able to reach the Elite 8 the last two years? Coaching.

Geno goes after players that will fit into his system....essentially a team of unselfish role players....players who were stars in high school, but buy into his team concept.

Prior to the '08-'09 season, UConn signed the #1 HS player in the country, a 6'5 guard named Elena Della Donne. She is probably the greatest pure shooter in the history of the women's game. She attended a pre-season two week get together in June when the team held voluntary uncoached scrimmages and practices. She packed her bags and went home to Delaware after two days. She knew at the time she would be unable to give the intensity needed to play at UConn. In August, she officially left UConn and enrolled at Delaware. She is now playing there in obscurity with little chance of ever making it to the NCAA tournament, and if she does it will be as a 13 to 16 seed. We certainly haven't missed her.

I have to admit that I don't watch but I find it shockingly hard to believe that the highest profile school in the country with a 90 game win streak that regularly beats teams by 30+ points doesnt have a huge talent disparity when compared to the other "top" teams.

http://www.wnba.com/features/confere...9_bigeast.html

When looking at the 24 WNBA players from the BIG EAST, the 12 players from the University of Connecticut jump off the page. We could have easily created an All-UConn squad that probably could have competed with some other conference squads.

Cannon Shell 12-23-2010 11:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind (Post 736228)
I actually think the two streaks are extremely comparable. I wonder what the lines were in the VAST majority of UCLA's games. I bet the competitive level was shockingly similar. Division I men's hoop was a LOT different back then and UCLA was absolutely stacked. No doubt UConn has a similar competitive advantage, though many women's programs have gotten much stronger since Diana and Sue were playing there.

It's an amazing achievement and I bet Bill Walton would agree with me.

In the history of the NCAA womans tourney, Uconn and Tenn have won more championships than every other team combined, 15-14. The talent pool is simply not that deep and the teams getting the premier players (currently Uconn and formerly Tenn) win 50% of the championships. The difference in the little womans basketball that I watch seems to be the bottom teams have practically no chance to ever beat a top team.

blackthroatedwind 12-24-2010 12:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell (Post 736338)
In the history of the NCAA womans tourney, Uconn and Tenn have won more championships than every other team combined, 15-14. The talent pool is simply not that deep and the teams getting the premier players (currently Uconn and formerly Tenn) win 50% of the championships. The difference in the little womans basketball that I watch seems to be the bottom teams have practically no chance to ever beat a top team.

Over a period of 10 or so years, how many championships did UCLA win?

I'm not saying it is the SAME....just that it is MORE comparable than many people realize. I doubt you find that an outrageous claim.

herkhorse 12-24-2010 05:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind (Post 736228)

It's an amazing achievement and I bet Bill Walton would agree with me.


oooooohhh, Bill Walton



Slewbopper 12-24-2010 05:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell (Post 736338)
In the history of the NCAA womans tourney, Uconn and Tenn have won more championships than every other team combined, 15-14. The talent pool is simply not that deep and the teams getting the premier players (currently Uconn and formerly Tenn) win 50% of the championships. The difference in the little womans basketball that I watch seems to be the bottom teams have practically no chance to ever beat a top team.

Does UConn get top recruits? Definitely, but other schools, Duke and Tennessee specifically, get players who rated just as highly coming out of high school. What makes UConn different? They have a great, great coach who knows which players to recruit to fit his system and he knows how to develope them once they get to his program.

In '99, UConn had their first great recruiting class. BTW's girl Sue Bird was rated #10 in that class. She was recruited as a shooting guard but when the point guard went down before her college career began, Sue took over the reins. She ended her college career as a three time Lieberman Award winner (Best point guard) and the 2002 player of the year. She became the #1 pick in the W draft and is presently considered the best point guard in the world.

OTOH, in '08 Tennessee signed the #2 player coming out of high school (same year as Maya Moore). In '09 they had one of the best classes of all time with 6 players ranked in the top 20. In the last two seasons, they have won two NCAA tourney games. Last year, Baylor as a #4 seed beat #1 Tennessee and #2 Duke in their region, making it to the final four. Why? They have a great coach in Kim Mulkey who is second only to Geno.

Cannon, there is much more parity in the women's game now than there was ten years ago. UConn and Baylor just happen to stand alone this year just as UConn and Stanford did last year. This year unranked DePaul beat #3 at the time Stanford by 20. Unranked Syracuse beat #6 at the time Ohio State by 10. #20 Georgetown beat #5 Tennessee by 11. #14 at the time Florida State lost to Ivy cellar dweller Yale.

Cannon Shell 12-24-2010 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind (Post 736340)
Over a period of 10 or so years, how many championships did UCLA win?

I'm not saying it is the SAME....just that it is MORE comparable than many people realize. I doubt you find that an outrageous claim.

I guess all winning streaks are comparable to some degree.

Cannon Shell 12-24-2010 08:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slewbopper (Post 736353)
Does UConn get top recruits? Definitely, but other schools, Duke and Tennessee specifically, get players who rated just as highly coming out of high school. What makes UConn different? They have a great, great coach who knows which players to recruit to fit his system and he knows how to develope them once they get to his program.

In '99, UConn had their first great recruiting class. BTW's girl Sue Bird was rated #10 in that class. She was recruited as a shooting guard but when the point guard went down before her college career began, Sue took over the reins. She ended her college career as a three time Lieberman Award winner (Best point guard) and the 2002 player of the year. She became the #1 pick in the W draft and is presently considered the best point guard in the world.

OTOH, in '08 Tennessee signed the #2 player coming out of high school (same year as Maya Moore). In '09 they had one of the best classes of all time with 6 players ranked in the top 20. In the last two seasons, they have won two NCAA tourney games. Last year, Baylor as a #4 seed beat #1 Tennessee and #2 Duke in their region, making it to the final four. Why? They have a great coach in Kim Mulkey who is second only to Geno.

Cannon, there is much more parity in the women's game now than there was ten years ago. UConn and Baylor just happen to stand alone this year just as UConn and Stanford did last year. This year unranked DePaul beat #3 at the time Stanford by 20. Unranked Syracuse beat #6 at the time Ohio State by 10. #20 Georgetown beat #5 Tennessee by 11. #14 at the time Florida State lost to Ivy cellar dweller Yale.

My question to you is how accurate are the rankings for womans basketball, especially in regard to high school player? The mens rnkings can be pretty skewed and there is probably 1000 times more coverage/attention paid to that. Hell in football every year we hear how great of a class Notre Dame gets then once they actually hit the field we hear how slow they are or how the SEC schools get all the talent.

Coach Pants 12-24-2010 08:41 AM

The only similarity between the two teams is they both like p.ussy.

Slewbopper 12-24-2010 09:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coach Pants (Post 736379)
The only similarity between the two teams is they both like p.ussy.

I don't fault anyone that likes fish, but of course, looking at the source of this statement, it is just another of your idiotic generalizations inferring that all women that play basketball are dykes.

Coach Pants 12-24-2010 09:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slewbopper (Post 736383)
I don't fault anyone that likes fish, but of course, looking at the source of this statement, it is just another of your idiotic generalizations inferring that all women that play basketball are dykes.

It's a joke, you dumb creepy f.uck.

Slewbopper 12-24-2010 09:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell (Post 736377)
My question to you is how accurate are the rankings for womans basketball, especially in regard to high school player? The mens rnkings can be pretty skewed and there is probably 1000 times more coverage/attention paid to that..

I agree with you about the accuracy of the ratings. When Maya Moore was rated #1 in her class, the #2 player Angie Bjorkland chose Tennessee. Maya will be a 4 time All-American. Angie never will. There are 30 players in the country better than her. UConn's freshman point guard was ranked anywhere from 10 to 14 in the various rating services. She might be the best frosh in the country. My point is that Geno is very good at schmoozing kids that are not at the top of the list that turn out to be extremely good players.

Cannon, the recruiting in wcb is a lot more intense than you might think. Because of Title IX, the women receive just as many scholarships as the men. That money is going to be spent even if the program loses money.

Coach Pants 12-24-2010 09:53 AM

You talk a lot but say nothing.

I especially enjoyed your psychological analysis of a girl you only know through watching her play basketball. And all of your "insider" information on her father.

Just come out as a true douche and post your sports blog, you long-winded Faux intellectual.

Coach Pants 12-24-2010 11:35 AM

I'll be back later and expect you to reply in kind, slewbopper. You need to address the hypocrisy or do the wise thing and leave a much more powerful troll be. You don't and cannot f.uck with me. No matter how old school you are, son.

http://webcache.googleusercontent.co...ient=firefox-a

http://ladyvols.blogspot.com/2007/11...ker-alert.html

Can't have it both ways. Child please.

Slewbopper 12-24-2010 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coach Pants (Post 736392)
You talk a lot but say nothing.

I especially enjoyed your psychological analysis of a girl you only know through watching her play basketball. And all of your "insider" information on her father.

Just come out as a true douche and post your sports blog, you long-winded c.unt. Faux intellectual.

Wow....I guess you put me in my place. I feel fulfilled knowing that I was able to finally elicit more than a one sentence response from you after the 19,000 insulting one line posts you have made over the years.

Slewbopper 12-24-2010 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coach Pants (Post 736410)
I'll be back later and expect you to reply in kind, slewbopper. You need to address the hypocrisy or do the wise thing and leave a much more powerful troll be. You don't and cannot f.uck with me. No matter how old school you are, son.

http://webcache.googleusercontent.co...ient=firefox-a

http://ladyvols.blogspot.com/2007/11...ker-alert.html

Can't have it both ways. Child please.

So what is your point? I am a racist because I accused my fellow Huskie fans of just that? I go to more games than ever because more good seats are available. And regarding the Aurabass character, he isn't worth mentioning and got everything he deserved from me

dalakhani 12-24-2010 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slotdirt (Post 735649)
While I'm not saying a c-level high school team could beat the current UConn women's hoops teams, I understand randall's point. We had a #1 ranked in the state girls high school team when I was a freshman in high school, and as a big tune-up for the playoffs, their coach asked the freshmen boys coach if we could scrimmage them for an hour or so. We beat them by 30, and it wasn't even close.

Just out of curiosity, what year were you a freshman in high school?

dalakhani 12-24-2010 05:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind (Post 736340)
Over a period of 10 or so years, how many championships did UCLA win?

I'm not saying it is the SAME....just that it is MORE comparable than many people realize. I doubt you find that an outrageous claim.

I agree. Its actually quite comparable.

The difference in talent that UCLA was getting back then in comparison to what most other teams were getting is staggering. There were a few teams back then that went undefeated. If not for injuries in 1975, the hoosiers would probably have done it two years in a row. Isn't it interesting that since that 1976 Hoosier team, no NCAA men's team has finished undefeated? Why is that?

The game was much different then. There were a maximum of 25 teams in the tournament until 1975 when they expanded to 32 teams.

Recruiting was different then. It was more regional. There certainly weren't any other teams out west that were getting kids to come nationally like UCLA was. Other programs simply weren't paying the kind of money to kids that UCLA had been paying. That being the case, UCLA had a huge advantage. Sure they played midwest and east coast powers too, but a majority of the win streak came against overmatched west coast schools. Then they get to the tournament when you have to play a couple of tough games but the tourney for them back then was only like three games with no conference tourney.



Basketball was a much different game then. Yes, if you had a mens basketball team go on an 88 game winning streak TODAY, comparing UCONN'S winning streak would be pretty dumb. But taking into account the differences in the men's game back then and UCLA's massive competitive advantage over its foes, I think the streaks are much more comparable than some think.

dalakhani 12-24-2010 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by randallscott35 (Post 735579)
It is being played up by ESPN and UConn in particular. A C level men's high school team would dismember Uconn. Beyond non-story.

How are you in a position to make this judgement? What constitutes a "c" level high school basketball team? Does this vary by region? What is the size of this "c" level team? How tall is the front line?

Now, if you want to say that they would get beaten by a pretty good boys high school basketball team, I could agree with that. Heck, we have some boys teams in our area that could beat some men's college teams. Dematha or Montrose Christian would beat some division 1 men's teams. There is little doubt in my mind that they could handle UConn women.

The difference is mainly in size and not as much in skill although that would vary depending on the team. Top high school teams will have 6'6 wings and centers 6' 8" and up while women's teams are generally going to be shorter and smaller. In my mind, a "c" level high school team will have players that are about the same size or even smaller than the Uconn women and probably wouldn't be anywhere near as skilled and certainly not anywhere near as well coached or seasoned. The same would go for most division 2 or 3 schools and even some bad division 1 schools.

Slewbopper 12-25-2010 07:20 AM

dalakhani.... The top women's programs practice against men that attend their school, generally former high school players that are not good enough for the men's program. Probably the coaches at UConn, Tennessee, Duke, etc. would have the best idea what level men's teams they would be competitive against. Most of us can only speculate

Slewbopper 12-30-2010 12:29 PM

The streak will in all likelihood end tonight at Stanford. UConn is a very thin team that depends on 7 core players with two frosh sharing the post duties, one of whom is undersized at 6'1. Stanford has five quality post players ranging from 6'2 to 6'5. UConn's senior back up guard is out with a foot injury. Maya will play 40 minutes but it means that none of the 1 2 or 3 positions will get a rest. Early foul trouble to any player will be a killer

dalakhani 12-30-2010 10:14 PM

Nice call slewbopper.:tro:

Anyone know if there was a line?

MaTH716 12-30-2010 10:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dalakhani (Post 738450)
Nice call slewbopper.:tro:

Anyone know if there was a line?

Probably not, hence another reason why most people don't give a damn.

Reguardless, it was still a good call by Slew.

Slewbopper 12-30-2010 10:50 PM

From a lesbian trapped in a man's body, take that pantywaist puss/y pants

Coach Pants 12-30-2010 10:58 PM

That's your team. It's a win-win for you because you're a troll and all you really care about is being right. Add to the fact you're a sissy and of course you're going to pick against your team on the road because what's the worst that could happen? They win?

You might as well ask tampax to sponsor your post.

RockHardTen1985 12-30-2010 11:00 PM

Uconn was minus 11.

Coach Pants 12-30-2010 11:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RockHardTen1985 (Post 738467)
Uconn was minus 11.

In Bizarro Vegas?


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:01 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.