I think you are absolutely correct. It serves as a smokescreen and diversion for his agenda and allows....like literally this crazy statement to be put out showing more concern for illegal's wages than upholding American laws.

http://www.thefoxnation.com/illegal-...ght-fair-wages

yeah but it was a ridiculous analogy

I find that to be an extremely far-fetched argument. Is it possible? Yes, it is certainly possible but it is extremely far-fetched in my view. This is not one of those cases where all publicity is good publicity. Bad publicity is bad publicity, period. And you are way off the mark if you think that it's only far-right wackos that have questions about where he was born.

Polls they have done show that a majority of Americans say he should release his birth certificate. If he doesn't release it, it just makes it look like he is hiding something. Nobody likes that. Everybody likes transparency.

I know that you guys know most of the facts of this case but most of the people out there that think this whole thing is a non-issue don't even know the facts. Most of those people think that his birth-ceritificate has already been released because that was what the mainstream media reported.

I don't take that as an insult because I'm sure you would think that any analogy that doesn't make a good case for gay marriage is a bad analogy.

Let's hear you come up with an analogy that would argue against gay marriage. That shouldn't be hard for you to do. I can always argue either side of an issue. You should be able to do it.

If you can't come up with one, then you will prove my case. My case being that you would think any analogy is bad that doesn't make a gay marriage ban look like a huge injustice.

Well, let's say that he's not an American, and that's what he's hiding.

If that's the case, this was the best plan in all of history -- and I mean ALL of history. To take a Black boy born in 1961, three years before the Civil Rights Act of 1964, come up with the awesome idea that this foreigner of color would 50 years later be able to infiltrate the United States government by passing as a citizen, and deciding that in lieu of any actual proof that they may need to show, they would put a congratulations to themselves in the paper just in case they needed an alibi 50 years later.

Mind you, this child then had to have the aptitude to go graduate law school, become an excellent public speaker, win elections....and they foresaw all of this 50 years in advance in a country where Blacks at the time still didn't even have full and equal rights.

Really?

How can such a wingnut theory be anything *but* a non-issue? Are you kidding me? If that's the case, the f*cking guy deserves to be President anyway because of the sheer amazing power of awesome that it took to hatch that plan over the course of 50 years, and the brilliance of his parents/keepers/masterminds who had the ability to choose the *one* child who would be able to fulfill this plan, and make a newspaper announcement about his birth to quell the inevitable questions five decades later.

Yes. You're right Rupert, the real fools in this situation are the ones who don't ask to see his birth certificate. You got us there, because they've made fools of us with the most awesome plan in the history of the universe. This is like the Trojan Horse on 50-year steroids. FFS.

that could be very well true.

I will say, your analogy was better than the "Bible" arguements that always follow the gay marriage debate.

Who are you arguing with? I don't know a single person in the world that thinks this was a vast conspiracy that started 50 years ago. Whoever said that?

I don't know the explanation for the newspaper announcement of his birth. Has it been authenticated? If it has, then I could come up with another argument as to why they made the announcement. Maybe his mom wanted people to think he was born in Hawaii so that he would immediately, automatically be a US citizen. Nobody is claiming that the announcement (assuming the announcemt was authentic) was put in the paper in case he ever wanted to run for President 50 years later. That is absurd.

Of course it is. That's why I can't believe that you're continuing to carry on like a fool with this stuff. "Nobody is arguing that, because that would be craaaaaazy!" As opposed to the very reasonable things you're writing. LOL. I just upped the ante a bit.

If he's not an American, that's really the only explanation for all of it, and it's only marginally more absurd than the insane birther theories to begin with. And these people who planned this out decades ago did excellent work. Geez, the more I type about this, the more I start to believe you, Rupert. They *really* just might have pulled this off!!!

What are you talking about? Nobody thinks that. Nobody thinks this was planned decades ago.

We don't even know that the newspaper announcements are authentic. And as I said, even if they are authentic, there are far more innocuous explanations than a 50 year conspircay theory. How about his mom wanting her son to be a US citizen?

If it makes you feel good to think that anyone who questions Obama's birthplace is crazy, then more power to you. Whatever makes you feel good is fine with me.

In that case, I feel excellent about having your approval to think birthers, yourself included, are f*cking nuts.

With real issues to complain about that have real merit, it simply amazes me that people waste their time with crazy conspiracy theories like this, rather than criticizing Obama on the things he should be criticized on. It just takes the teeth out of any other real criticism you lob his way, like anyone who thought Bush ordered 9/11 shouldn't be taken seriously in their other criticisms of Bush because clearly their entire mind is muddled with crap that doesn't allow them to think clearly.

Really though, who cares what the crazy guy who insists Obama is a Kenyan born in Nairobi thinks? Any real ability to be objective is obviously gone, and Obama is playing you and those like you for absolute hilarious fools by letting you embarrass yourself like this. Carry on.

Are you aware that snopes.com can't seem to make up their mind about what hospital Obama was born at.

"News sites swap Obama's birthplace like magic
UPI, Snopes change location within hours of WND report"

http://webcache.googleusercontent.co...&ct=clnk&gl=us

There is nothing fishy about that.

I forgot to mention that Obama's aunt said that he was born in Kenya. I'm sure all these things are just a coincidence. I'm sure he was born in Hawaii.

I should probably start another thread so this doesn't get lost, but from watching more interviews, I've come to have legitimate questions about whether Sarah Palin is a human.

I have several good reasons to question whether she's a human, and in fact believe that she is a Terrortron 4000 series robot, and that beneath her synthetic, but very real looking skin, there is little more than a series of malleable metal rods that have been formed in the shape of a human being.

I believe that the onus is on Sarah Palin to prove to me that she is, in fact, a human being and not a robot, and I look forward to your help in getting to the bottom of this, Rupert, as if you've taught me one thing today, it's that all questions, no matter how absurd, should be treated as though they are entirely legitimate. I think that as a potential presidential candidate in two years that I have a right to know whether a robot that cries tears of oil and WD-40 could possibly be elected President of this great country of ours, and it is her job, and hers alone, to prove this claim wrong.

Where he was born doesn't affect the job he is doing. Does it really matter whether he moved to Hawaii when he was 1 month old vs being born in Hawaii? It's not going to have any effect on his job perfomance.

Good point!

somebody should definately check her birth certifi...errr.. Warranty!!

Maybe his mom listed his race as white on the original and that would cost him most of his 'street cred'?

"Ms. Sarah Hussein Obama was very adamant that her grandson, Senator Barack Hussein Obama, was born in Kenya, and that she was present and witnessed his birth in Kenya, not the United States," Shuhubia continued in the affidavit.

"During the conversation, Ms. Sarah Hussein Obama never changed her reply that she was indeed present when Senator Barack Obama was born in Kenya," Shuhubia insisted in the affidavit.

"The affidavit documents that President Obama's step-grandmother was asked the questions several times, both in her native language, Swahili, and in English, and that the Anabaptists conducting the interview were confident she understood clearly the questions that were asked."

I can't figure out why anyone would think Obama might have been born in Kenya. It is so strange.

http://webcache.googleusercontent.co...&ct=clnk&gl=us

tons of street cred at Harvard Law School

He may not know it but lost all street cred in Chicago when he threw out that first pitch and lied about being a Sox fan. Too bad he didn't show up at a Hawks game or Cup celebration. The mayor and governor were both booed. I can't even imagine the welcome hockey fans from the President's home town would have greeted him with.

To hell with warranty, what's the return policy?!?!

Rupert, serious question: why do you think the federal government and many Republicans are "in on" the Obama birth coverup?

Why do you think Bush/Cheney, when they were still in the White House, still had all the power - didn't expose this during Obama's run for President?

Why did McCain, Romney, Hillary all fail to make this public?

Why did the Republican governor of Hawaii say Obama was born in Hawaii?

What explains the massive, bipartisan federal coverup cooperation by Obama's political enemies?

I think those are legitimate questions. I would say the answer is probably that many of those people didn't think his birthplace was a question. They probably figured he must have been born in Hawaii or someone would have discovered it a long time ago. Either that or they didn't thinik they could prove he wasn't born in Hawaii.

Right now there is a fairly big campaign involving lawyers, private investigators, etc. and they haven't been able to get anywhere. It's obviously not an easy thing to prove since they can't subpoena the birth certificate.

it's either what rupert said or the obvious answer.

this was a good effort on your part. but you might as well go argue with a boulder for all the good it'll do.

no evidence will ever convince a birther.

nothing.

ever.

the republican party is a huge organization, with tons of funding available...one would have to think they would have used everything in their power, including this, to aid them in remaining in the white house.

but they didn't. that speaks volumes about the total worth of this 'issue'.

a HUGE waste of :$: no wonder America is in the crapper. We have nutcases that spend tons of money on a stupid birth certificate for an American President that is no doubt, 100%, born in Hawaii. Then we have a political base that wont let it go, and wonder why others think they are crazy.

If his mother is in fact an American, I don't think it matters where he was born, that qualifies him as a citizen. Maybe I'm wrong. Not being raised in this country is how he came up with his unique worldview.

You guys make good points. He may have been born in Hawaii. But when you consider the facts that he won't release his birth certificate, his aunt says she was there when he was born in Kenya, the White House can't make up their mind about which hospital he was born at, the guy from the election board says he definitely wasn't born in Hawaii, etc., it raises some doubt.

Since you love my analogies, I will give you an analogy. Let's say that I meet a guy and I know 100 people who know this guy. The guy claims he is 35 years old. Of the 100 people that know him, 98 of them say that they have known him for a while and they are almost positive that he is in fact 35 years old. The other two people say that they think he is actually older. They think he is around 40 years old. So out of the 100 people that know him, 98 people are pretty sure that the guy is 35. The other 2 people don't believe it and they think the guy is around 40.

Now let's say that this guy swears he is 35 but he refuses to show anyone his driver's license. In that case, I would be suspicious of his age.

The difference there, though, is that you don't look like a total fool running around screaming conspiracy theories when wondering if a guy is 35 or whether he's 40, and he doesn't make a fool of you by not showing his driver's license.

You're not embarrassed in the situation above because you don't wind up looking like a raving lunatic.

That outcome is the key difference between that scenario and the birther one. Otherwise, it was an excellent comparison!

maybe he has a femine side and says age is nobodies business :D

That would be fine. Some people don't like to give their age. But if a guy is adamant about being 35, and yet refuses to show you his driver's license, I would be suspicious.

That is your opinion that anyone who questions Obama's birthplace is a raving lunatic. I'm sure there are plenty of people that agree with you. But I'm sure there are plenty of people who don't.

"FactCheck.org staffers have now seen, touched, examined and photographed the original birth certificate. We conclude that it meets all of the requirements from the State Department for proving U.S. citizenship. Claims that the document lacks a raised seal or a signature are false. We have posted high-resolution photographs of the document as "supporting documents" to this article. Our conclusion: Obama was born in the U.S.A. just as he has always said.[17]

An image of a sample Certificate of Live Birth issued by the State of Hawaii in 1961. The certificate includes detailed information such as hospital and physician names

The director of Hawaii's Department of Health, Chiyome Fukino, issued a statement confirming that the state held Obama's "original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures".[10][11]"

We all know about the certificate of live birth. The certificate of live birth does not prove anything. That is not a birth certificate. You do not need to be born in the US to get one of those.

The existence of Obama's ceritificate of live birth is not disputed by anyone.

The certificate of live birth proves, according to the State of Hawaii, that the guy was born in Hawaii. The independent newspaper announcements of the birth verify it happened.

'Zig posted this a long time ago:
http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2...n_the_usa.html

There are also plenty of people who believe that if they blow themselves up, they'll be rewarded with 72 virgins in the afterlife.

There are also plenty of people who believe that George Bush ordered 9/11.

Not all opinions are created equal. Not every opinion should be respected as legitimate just because there is a group of people that believes it.

That's the problem. Not that you seem to think I don't know what an opinion is, or that you're entitled to one just like I am. The problem is that opinions are not necessarily equal just because someone says "well that's my opinion."

I say grass is green. If you tell me it's not, and that it's your opinion, that doesn't make your opinion legitimate. It is, obviously, still the opinion that you're certainly entitled to, but it's still ridiculous and laughable and absurd and should not be treated as anything less than such just because you're hiding behind the tired old "well that's your opinion, and this is mine, which I'm entitled to" routine.

And that's how we've ended up here. You're entitled to be a crazy birther, but you shouldn't expect to get treated like anything other than a crazy birther, as much as you seem to keep acting as though this is something along the lines of investigative journalism (certainly what WND is known for: objective investigative journalism!!1!!!!11!), rather than crackpot crazy conspiracy theory. If the shoe fits, wear it.

I agree with you 100% that not all opinions are equal.

You misunderstood what I said. When I said that plenty of people would disagree with you, I was not talking about birthers disagreeing with you about where Obama was born. I was disagreeing with your assumption that everyone thinks that anyone who questions Obama's birthplace is a "raving lunatic".

From the article I linked aerlier:

"Obama has only proffered on the Internet a "Certification of Live Birth" to assert he was born in Hawaii, but that document was available to children not born in Hawaii at the time of Obama's birth. Many people remain unaware a child could be born somewhere else and still receive a Hawaii certification. State law specifically allows "an adult or the legal parents of a minor child" to apply to the health department and, upon unspecified proof, be given the birth document."

http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=165633

Rupert..you're a smart dude. Don't burn credibility on this. As I said earlier, the Right's biggest fault is they just bash EVERYTHING...You can only cry wolf so many times before the credible criticism gets lost in the muddle of everything else.

Who really cares either you like his policies or you dont and in 2and 1/2 years it can all be changed. It is my opinon that the current President is in so far over his head that he will be relieved to be voted out at the next Presidental election.