No horse in the country beats Rachel unless she injures herself in the race. Period.

12-12-0-0 :cool:

:eek:









THUD

You really are a ****** I see...

How about this stat:

116-111-108-108-101-103-100-99

Yeah, those are Rachel's last 8 beyer speed figures...Zenyatta, hell any horse in this country wishes they could run those, but nothing can. This is the best horse in America, male or female, and the sooner you come to the realization of that, the easier it will be to accept when Rachel is horse of the year. By the way, that 99 came in October of her 2YO season, which OOPS, coincidentily seems to be Zenyatta's MOST RECENT figure.

So figures decide who is the better horse? Im not saying she is or isnt the best horse but this argument is weak. Zenyatta is the reigning champ and has done nothing wrong.

It's easy to do nothing wrong when you're doing the same thing over and over and only running every few months. ;)

far more to it then figures, altho that is an easy way to point to supremacy. rachel has won by huge margins, has set records, came close to the record in the haskell while wide and on the slop..has taken on and beaten the boys not once, but twice, in grade one company-her latter race by open lengths (just like every race this year except the preakness), has run on how many tracks now? and is now going to take on open company.
zenyatta was all out to win by a scant nose vs her peers, you don't need more than one hands worth of fingers to count how many tracks she's run on, has not taken on males in her age group, or taken on open company. her lack of racing and lack of competition are strikes against her. were she not a one run closer, she wouldn't get near the attention, but for some reason race fans love those one run closers. is she the reigning distaff champ? yes. does that mean anything this year? no. she'll get top older mare while rachel could well get HOTY.

i wish she'd have smashed the field last time out. with that narrow win, they'll be very hesitant to take her anywhere vs males.

Although I could have done without Borel hitting her in the stretch 10 times times.....Inexcusable.

I totally disagree with the bolded. Running style has nothing to do with how much attention she gets. Its the streak...its her dominance over the division over the last year and a half. She gets about as much attention as Azeri did and she ran most of her races on the engine.

FTFY.

I dont understand the "reigning champ" thing either. Just because you win an award one year SHOULD NOT give you a leg up for the next year.

If Rachel wins the Woodward, she should be HOY, 3YO filly champ, 3YO colt champ, Champion older horse and Champion Older Mare.

Zenyatta has done nothing this year to win any awards IMO. She still has a couple opportunities to change that..

I like Zenyatta, but it's important to put this in perspective too. Nobody is saying that Rachel is beating up on any soon-to-be legendary superstars by any stretch, but Zenyatta's "peers" this year are for the most part, not even close to Grade I quality in any way ....here's what I said elsewhere as far as facing quality competition.

Of the three runners-up in Zenyatta's 2009 races, Life Is Sweet is the only one who even belongs in the conversation.

Let's not get carried away by her gutsy Clement Hirsch win over the barely Grade III-quality (at best...I'm being generous here) Anabaa's Creation who was sent postward in that spot at 22-1 off a scintillating no-excuses 5th-place finish against 3rd-level allowance company in her prior start, and who hasn't proven herself to be of any significant class (at least of the kind we'd be talking about when discussing the "real race horses" our leading HOY contender had beaten!) since 2007.

Or perhaps we're talking about Briecat, whose career highlight came in winning the Grade II Bayakoa against six other foes, but whose 2009 record is marginal at best, considering that she has been soundly, borderline embarrassingly-beaten in all of her 2009 starts except for...wait for it...the time she ran within two and a half lengths of Zenyatta. Her other four starts of the year have led to drubbings of a combined 39 lengths against inferior competition.

Of course you can pick at Rachel's opponents too, but let's be intellectually honest here and cut the pretending that there is some great talent disparity between who they are beating. And something tells me that Rachel wouldn't be life and death to beat Anabaa's Creation either, but that's pure conjecture on my part.

I dont know what the reason is but I get no excitement from Zenyatta. Probably my east coast bias, especially since the poly came to California, but I think it goes beyond that. I loved when Lava Man was on top of the world, at least out west. But Zenyatta does nothing for me. I could care less when she races.

......yeah horses like her are a dime a dozen:rolleyes:

i'm not saying it's the only reason, but it's a big reason why-people love closers that come flying right at the end. they never get accused of stealing a race like a confirmed front-runner. the link below is to an article on bloodhorse. honestly, i didn't read it-and just barely glanced at it when i went to see if it was still available. the title alone was what caught my eye the other day.

http://cs.bloodhorse.com/blogs/racin...-a-closer.aspx

when i say 'peers' it has more to do with her facing off vs fellow distaffers-not making any statements about their ability to be competitive-or not. just like when i say that rachel has run vs her peers-they're all the same age. other than that, certainly far from equal!

i enjoy both horses, and have loved seeing their races. but i think only one of the two will still be mentioned and have horses compared to her years from now-and it's not the one based out west that i'm talking about.

:tro:

LOL




Yo Beyer boy ...






Breeders' Cup CHAMPION :cool:

Rachel Alexandra: Horse of the Year to be...Where's Zenyatta's horse of the year? I guess I seemed to have missed that one.

Been a loooooooooong time since a 3yo filly took an open dirt route like the Woodward



Are all you Rachael fans willing to bet the ranch that she'll prevail this weekend?

Actually, no filly has ever won the Woodward. But see, her connections are all about making history, especially some that goes beyond winning back-to-back Lady's Secrets.

NT

you love it when people answer a question by trashing someone else.

you stay classy

No problem. I especially love to do it when a known rabble-rouser who has said absolutely nothing productive about the horse in question asks a back-handed question.

And please, in the future, don't kid yourself into thinking i'm ever going to pass up an opportunity to hurl some mud Zenyatta's way in a thread featuring Smooth Operator.

NT

I'm gonna stay classy like 10 point says.

I'm not willing to bet the ranch that she wins this weekend. I think it will be her toughest challenge.


But I AM willing to bet the ranch that you will still be an idiot this weekend.


Go U of A!!

As we discuss the race that may or may not ever happen I can't help but think back to Bernadini and Invasor as they approached the Breeder's Cup Classic. Sleek, quick Bernadini thrashing all who came his way with style and flair. Then you had Invasor, scratching out of the Gold Cup as many thought out of fear, only beating Sun King, SUN KING!!! by a nose in the Whitney. There was no way Invasor had a shot to beat Bernadini based on those efforts.

We know what happened don't we? That's why they run the race.

Going back even further, how many Alydar apologists are still out there thinking that off his Flaming, Florida Derby and Blue Grass he was going to chew Affirmed up and spit him out in the Derby. In fact people ridiculed Affirmed's path to the crown and the fact that he was "all out" to win the San Felipe and Hollywood Derby. Judas Priest!! Pincay hit him 8 times in the Santa Anita Derby.

How did that work out? That's why they run the race.

Hm.

I thought Bernardini had no shot of beating Invasor and think that Zenyatta would have no shot of beating Rachel Alexandra.

I know. Confuses the logic. Rachel Alexandra is not Bernardini...ie, she's not a false star, but the real thing.

EDIT: Actually to be factually correct, I didn't say Bernardini had "no shot" of beating Invasor, and before the Classic, implied that he could just be a freak. I also noted that he turned into a pig the only time he got looked in the eye...which he, as we all remember, did again in the Classic. Rachel does not have that same question to answer.

Wow, a pig? I thought Bernardini ran a really good race in the Classic. One can argue that the premature move by Castellano didnt help his chances either. I wish every horse I bet on was that much of a pig.

Sun King was a tough MFER.. I thought Sun King a a helluva lot better then most.

Bernandini was an extremely fast colt. He was far from a fraud.

Agreed. He lost some tough races that year including the Met Mile. My point was Invasor was less stylish than Bernadini, yet when they came into the stretch at Churchill, Invasor ran right by him.

He was racing at the time you were off your meds....at least I hope that is your excuse.

I don't get the Bernardini bashing?

I don't get comparing Bernardini to Rachel Alexandra -- when he had blown away short fields without ever getting looked in the eye (then folded when he finally did) and she's eyeballed horses, pressed sick paces and held off a Derby winning closer after doing so.

There is a point to make about her not being unbeatable when compared to Zenyatta, but comparing her to Bernardini to do so is not the way to do it, IMO.

Lol ... "a known rabble-rouser", eh



By the way, NTamm1215 ... wasn't just talking about the Woodward ... but any open G1 (or G2) dirt route.


Believe I read that a Lukas filly took the Clark nine or ten years ago.

Well, you managed to keep it "classy" for three sentences, Antichrist32.


More than I would've expected from you. lol




And please, spare me this "U of A" nonsense.


Trojans OWN that j-v squad on the gridiron. :cool:

Throw SS in there for good measure, Revidere


Lots of EG yahoos dissed that great Cali champion too...

Trojans also own houses they didnt pay for. The Jeff Mullins of college football (the only sport that dirtbag school is good at anyway)

wrong

if you only knew.

I am sure Ronald Johnson's and Nick Perry's family are enjoying LA, suddenly the whole family relocated to socal from southwest detroit. Probably have good jobs but I only know about being provided living accomodations.