Vic is one of the good guys (I think)....why so harsh Coach?

The 2005 American Oaks call.

This is bad?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-cJiRogQ0k

I bit..

and laughed

Jballscalls with a solid endorsement of the call in the comments section..

I remember a thread or two about this in the past...

You guys who insist his horse (4-1 I believe) had no shot are out of your minds. Sitting in a good spot well back behind a horse setting fractions that was never gonna hold up....Rosario HAD him in the right spot early...and if he didnt make a bonehead save ground move he ahd every shot of winning. Sure the 1 won going away going WIDE around the traffic. But the 8 had 1st run...had NO excuses...except Rosario rode the horse into a dying horse.

Try watching the replay....even Stevie Wonder thought is was a brutal ride...

The stretch call is my signature on this site LOL Still my favorite call and i get chills when i hear it. I've told Vic and many others the story before. I was sitting in the quarter chute cafe at Emerald Downs watching the race and the hair on the back of my neck absolutely stood up down the lane!! I went and bought a pair of binoculars and started practing being an announcer on the roof of Emerald the very next day.

10 lengths behind the winner who ahd a WIDE/CLEAN trip...if knucklehead Rosario doesnt get stuck down on the rail he had every shot of winning.

You cant honestly use the margin of win....the 8 stopped dead....if he doesnt stop dead, the 1 , while still could have won, would not have beat him by 10...thats a guarantee......you do understand that when a horse stops dead and another horse who doesnt goes by, the horse with the clean triphas a big advantage right?


I cant believe that such a simple thing is causing some to be so confused...

I have.....I suggest you watch the 8 horse....

Do you think the 8 got a clean trip/good ride?

I saw the race twice already. He obviously did not get a clean trip as he was snubbed at the rail but it was just a matter of circumstance rather than a bad ride.

Rosario had him in nice perfect spot turning for home and urged his horse on and was slowly inching past the leader when he got pinned. He tried to go through the opening on a rail that just didn open for him. What could he have done otherwise?? Did you want him to swing outside, lose ground and then urge his horse on??? It was just one of those unfortunate times when the rail did not open. I really dont blame his ride.

As I said before NO ONE was going to beat that #1 horse.

Thank you Eajinabi well put.

Thanks.

This is not a Priest. It's o.k. to simply note a bad ride. Don't know wtf the boy was thinking, but they were not quality thoughts. I can see why he likes that outside stretch move, because he does fk up a lot when he is inside. He gets a lot of effort out of horses. That's his main attribute. His decision-making has never really been that great. Damn near got someone killed at Del Mar. I guess nobody was responsible for that either.

Not really sure on how "bad" this kid is as you guys says he is. I havent really paid attention closely to his rides. From what I see from the stats he is probably one of the top 10 jocks in the country right now.

He is a kid and has very few years of riding behind him and all I can say is that he will learn from his mistakes and just get better.

So you think it is wise to take a horse who has momentum coming towards a dying horse and stay inside of him instead of "swinging wide" and going around the stopping horse ?


This should be good....

This argument is getting worse and worse

Here's what I want to know from Vic. I'd like to why one of your favorite clients(Doug O'neil) is allowed to keep training after twice running atleast a 38mmole/l Co2 horse. They let these guys cheat right up to anything 37 and below. I mean that seems like plenty of cheating for your boy to get away with without getting a 38 or more(twice.) This is a common crook. Why do they bargain with a crook? You say you care about this sport, but you don't care about this crook being allowed to train after twice cheating past a 37? He had one in 2006,and another in 2008. All he has to do is pay a fine, and not get caught cheating for a year. California racing is pandering to criminals. I'll come right out and say it's an embarassment to Southern California. Will you? Why do we put up with this crap? Where are the morals and ethics? NOWHERE..Gone...Cheat n' pay the fine. That's the filth going on repeatedly. These are crooks that shouldn't be allowed at the track.


The California Horse Racing Board entered into a stipulated agreement with trainer Doug O’Neill, who agreed to pay a fine of $7,500 and to serve a 30-day suspension, which shall be stayed pending a one-year probation.

According to a CHRB release, the agreement stems from a Jan. 17 race at Santa Anita when the O’Neill-trained Chicks Rule exceeded the regulatory threshold of 37.0mml/l for total carbon dioxide (TCO2). This is a Class 3 violation.

Chicks Rule finished first in the third race. The stewards at Santa Anita previously issued a ruling disqualifying Chicks Rule and redistributing the purse. The suspension is stayed provided O’Neill has no additional Class 1, 2, or 3 violations for one year.

[quote=SCUDSBROTHER]Here's what I want to know from Vic. I'd like to why one of your favorite clients(Doug O'neil) is allowed to keep training after twice running atleast a 38mmole/l Co2 horse. They let these guys cheat right up to anything 37 and below. I mean that seems like plenty of cheating for your boy to get away with without getting a 38 or more(twice.) This is a common crook. Why do they bargain with a crook? You say you care about this sport, but you don't care about this crook being allowed to train after twice cheating past a 37? He had one in 2006,and another in 2008. All he has to do is pay a fine, and not get caught cheating for a year. California racing is pandering to criminals. I'll come right out and say it's an embarassment to Southern California. Will you? Why do we put up with this crap? Where are the morals and ethics? NOWHERE..Gone...Cheat n' pay the fine. That's the filth going on repeatedly. These are crooks that shouldn't be allowed at the track.


I am not sure how common a crook doug o'neil is. He probaly needs to be a better cheater if hes only raking in 14% winners

[quote=eajinabi]Now it's o.k. to cheat if you're only winning at 14%. That's rich.

THis is my last post on this thread because you are determined to get the last word in, I have no clue what your dislike for Rosario is. But you definitely have one.

BUT that said you seriously need to go watch the replay Again and again and again and again,, Rosario was commited to the rail from the 7/16th's pole until he had to Check
I am going to let you figure out what that means if you even know where the 7/16th's pole is.

[quote=SCUDSBROTHER]I never said its ok to cheat. You said hes a common crook but his winning percent says otherwise.

[quote=eajinabi]Yea, he kind of specializes in getting claimers to run pretty good in stakes. Notice that? Look at him get that Optional Claimer Modification to come within what? A length of Grade 2 winner Life is Sweet last Sunday? There's a lot of them. What about the horse who had it's nose in front of Cowboy Cal in early January? Almost won that huh? That's after Baffert gave up. Mandella thought Peace Chant was worth just $62,500, but O'neil showed him the horse can win that much in one damn race with him..(miracle.!!)

if he keeps this crap up, he'll get good three year olds and make a run at an eclipse...

[quote=SCUDSBROTHER]
Its not like that horse who came second in the cowboy cal registered triple digit beyers. i will be surprised he cracked 90 on that run. What did he do in his next race?? nothing.

Peace Chant did win last weekend but where did he win it at??? Turf Paradise. Who did he run against??? Other former ALW OC.

Keeps it up, and he might actually have to serve the suspension.

[quote=eajinabi]I think the horse is called INFORMED, and Baffert put him in for what 25k-50k claiming? It had a 22k purse. Now it's running 2nd to Cowboy Cal, and ahead of Magnum. Those 2 came right back to win graded stakes, O.K. ?
Peace Chant couldn't beat 62,500 claimers, but (with Oneil's potions) could beat Machismo(who just ran a nice 2nd to Georgie Boy...A length off In Summation before that.) I'm still waiting for the explanation on Modification being pretty close to winning that Grade 2 last Sunday. What did Modification beat the week before? Caramel Coffee?

I think I am just amazed how someone can defend his ride in that race...it was absolutely horrendous. The "what was he supposed to do...swing wide" comment has to make DT's top 10 moronic comments list for 2009.

These dopey comments entertain me.....

I think he makes a lot of dumb moves out on the track...and it seems a lot of others feel the same way.

The 7/16th pole is right after the 6/16th's pole but before the 8/16th's pole.

You cant accept defeat so I suggest you do one thing:

Go to Santa Anita tommorow, stand in front of the jocks room and demand your 2 dollars back from Rosario himself. There is nothing else I can say to you.

Your arguments are dumb, funny, and pointless all at the same time.

[quote=SCUDSBROTHER]Not to sound like a Monday morning QB but...

Its not like Magnum and Cowboy Cal are popping in the Beyer numbers themselves (sad to think these are your two favorites for the SA Cap). Its not that Informed hasnt run in graded company before. He ran in the Goodwood and ran with the likes of Casino Drive, Monzante and Dakota Phone in the past in ALW races. None of these types were running in the San Pasqual.

Didnt Machismo run in ALW OC just in October himself in Calder? Ran in 2 graded since being in the hands of Sadler and he ran well (can you accuse Sadler the same thing you are accusing Oneil of?)
Peace chant did have back class in him. Better than any horse he ran against at TuP.

Moderation did not win, did not come second, did not come third. sHe came fourth and basically flattened out when she tried to make a run. The others behind him in that race was shittier than him.

Why am I defending Oneil because
There definetley are other trainers who seek your attention when it comes to cheating. Show me a legit Dutrow, Asmussen, Scott Lake, Mitchell, Sadler winner in recent years. These are the +25% winning trainers who magically convert horses into superstars.

[quote=eajinabi]Mitchell, O'neil, and Mullins have each been caught atleast twice with high CO2. That's unacceptable, and they should be gone(period.) Tired of this crap. Just get rid of them. Fkn stealing from others(period.) As it is, they test for way too high a threshold, and then say"we only got 2 positives last year." Well, yea, because you're too fkn corrupt to test from 34-37mmol co2. As it is they want to do less testing due to expense(corrupt cubed.)

[quote=SCUDSBROTHER]Informed was claimed last summer. Its not like he was just claimed and immediately moved way up. Maybe he had physical issues that are being handled better now. Why is it so surprising that a $500,000 purchase ran well? The winner only had a mid 90s beyer anyways.

Did you bother to look at what Peace Chant's record is on dirt? And by the way he ran 107 beyer in the past as well. This horse has an awesome pedigree. A $900,000 purchase. Again not surprising when placed on his best surface that he ran well.

Modification was not even close to winning that race. Finished 4th not 2nd.

Before you go ripping somebody you might want to have your facts straight.

Sadler is trying every way to cheat that he can. Was supposed to stop using steroids on July 1st, and kept using until his barn got raided. Basically, wasn't gunna stop cheating until they starting fining him etc. He, Cerin, and Mitchell have the most violations of meds. Mitchell kept using steroids well into August as well. Those 2 don't really seem to care (they know they can just pay a fine.) Mitchell gets caught doing all kind of stuff n' always just gets a fine. It's unbelievable. It's sick. They need to clean it up. Start being able to cap horses again.

[quote=Philip]Modification didn't lose by much.

http://www.equibase.com/premium/eqbP...&RACE=A&BorP=B

Goes from optional claiming to being about a length off LIFE IS SWEET.
You 're all enabling a known cheater. This is why nothing gets done. Your so used to cheating trainers that you don't care. Mandella dropped Peace Chant down, because he was struggling. He woke up because he went to a cheater(you can't deny he is a cheater.) There are 3 ways to mask cheating: change surface, blinkers, and put a leading rider on. That's three reasons a cheater can use. You just used one of them. Honu works for Mandella. Lets hear her opinion on how a horse who ran 6th for $62,500 is CRUSHING IN A 100K STAKES(He never won a stakes of any sort for Mandella.) You're saying Mandella gave away a stakes horse. I don't think so. They lost about 700k right? See what she says. TO BE HONEST, HE CHEATED TWICE, AND HE SHOULD BE GONE. I don't know why people want cheaters in their game. It's stupid. This is the problem with the game. New people aren't gunna bet if they aren't sure it's honest. It sure isn't honest. You let a guy get two HIGH CO2 violations, and just send him out there to do it again. He just made 60k in one damn race. What's a $7500 fine every couple years? Nothing. I understand he has a charming regular guy personality. O.K.? I GET IT, BUT HE IS A CHEATER. People didn't believe me about him on the ESPN BOARD, and after 2 high co2 violations, they still don't want to believe it. Get it straight. He cheats.

[quote=Philip]You know what facts should matter here? You're trying to put a bib on a cheater that's already been caught twice running over 37mmole CO2. We shouldn't be talking about him. He shouldn't be allowed to train. The only reason he is still training here is because of a complete lack of ethics out here. All these guys who have been caught milkshaking twice should be gone.

[quote=SCUDSBROTHER]
you know horse racing sucks when Cowboy Cal is winning graded races. :zz:

doesn't every rider make mistakes at some point?? and if you stay to the rail and save ground, your going to get burned and stopped once in a while. Sometimes i'd rather have guys save ground than go out into the 5 path all the time (see too much of that at PM)

Lots of haters on here, everyone's entitled to their opinion. Vic and Joel, keep up your success guys!

When I need a good laugh,I know I can always count on The Derby Trail forum and its cast of idiots to provide one for me.This thread has been hilarious!!Thanks guys.