Originally Posted by Bobby Fischer

Brown is a rockstar. Monmouth park will put on a show and there will be a good sized crowd.
Maybe even play some Springsteen.

Originally Posted by Quiet Chris

Highly unlikely that there will be a good sized crowd. Monmouth is not going to ever get a big crowd once the summer is over. 10,000 is probably what you will get although they will come up with something a little higher for pr reasons.

Originally Posted by Bobby Fischer

Brown is a rockstar. Monmouth park will put on a show and there will be a good sized crowd.
Maybe even play some Springsteen.

Originally Posted by hoovesupsideyourhead

I GOT 100 BUCKS SAYS HE DOES NOT WIN ON THE TURF PM ME IF YOU WANT SOME...

Originally Posted by RollerDoc

Look for a much larger crowd than what you are saying.

Originally Posted by Quiet Chris

NO WAY. The weather and the fact that nobody really cares about the race might keep it below 7500. Last weekend they got 2500, I wouldn't expect anything more than 10K. Nobody cares about Big Brown running against a bunch of grade 2 grass horses.

Now if he showed up for the JCGC, Belmont probably would get 25K for the Curlin-BB matchup.

Originally Posted by RollerDoc

Will you give me 8-1 odds that it is north of 10,000?

Originally Posted by RollerDoc

While most on here agree that this year's crop of three year olds haven't been that teriffic, that still does not stop me from starting yet another Big Brown thread.

Because while this is still 2008, he has been the best horse for horse racing this year. Curlin may be faster, but we don't know that. We do know that Curlin cannot draw a crowd or have near the fan base that Big Brown does. So Big Brown was much needed for this sport. At least for this year.

Despite his contraversial connections, the Belmont/Triple Crown disappointment, or the slight win over the out of gas apprentice Coal Play in the Haskell, the popularity of Big Brown has not really lost his luster. Afterall the $200K Monmouth Stakes on Saturday is $500K only because the infamous Big Brown is entered. The Haskell saw their best attendance in years because race fans wanted to see Big Brown.

Arguably only Barbaro and maybe Smarty Jones have garnered more fan attention than Big Brown in the past so many years. With the exception of his past two races, the rest were all WINS and have been extremely impressive. Winning from the posts he had at FL DERBY and KY Derby is worth a salute to this horse.

So while I have an affection for Big Brown, I am also sad as his racing career is nearing the end. Most likely he has two races to go including the BCC. Of course I hope he wins them both.

I guess I was wondering your thoughts on how Big Brown left his mark on the 2008 season? Was he good for horse racing?

Originally Posted by cmorioles

Anyone betting Big Brown in that field at the price he will be needs to rethink their paramutuel involvement in the game.

Originally Posted by Samarta

There's a lot to debate on this one. Let's talk about the popularity. While Barbaro's story became very gripping and appealed to everyone, his popularity as a race horse didn't really happen until after the breakdown. At the derby he was one of those horses that had a shot to win. As far as Smarty Jones is concerned Big Brown nor any horse in a long long time doesn't come close to being as popular as Smarty Jones. The numbers alone prove that point. Big Brown was popular because of the antics of his ridiculous connections. He's a nice horse, but to rate him in popularity in the same league as SJ or Barbaro is ridiculous.

I'm not real sure about the crowd thing, the Haskell always draws as many people as they can put in that place regardless of who is running.

Depending on where Curlin races after the Jockey Club will determine HOY, but right now there is a filly on the West Coast that if she wins out, will win HOY in my opinion, because I don't BB wins today or in the BCC.

Originally Posted by Danzig

i would think curlin is still #1 in everyones book for HOY. zenyatta would have to take on and beat the boys in the bcc to win the award. and if curlin misses, i don't know that she'd catch him then. i think everyone understands why curlin won't go west, and i don't think anyone will hold it against him for not going.

Originally Posted by Danzig

i would think curlin is still #1 in everyones book for HOY. zenyatta would have to take on and beat the boys in the bcc to win the award. and if curlin misses, i don't know that she'd catch him then. i think everyone understands why curlin won't go west, and i don't think anyone will hold it against him for not going.

Originally Posted by Samarta

Well but you don't win HOY on potential. I understand why they probably aren't sending him to the BCC but if Zenyatta wins her next race then the Distaff, BB doesn't win the BCC Zenyatta wins HOY. I think Curlin is the best horse out there, but if he skips the classic I think the only way he wins HOY is for BB and Zenyatta to lose.

Originally Posted by RollerDoc

If Big Brown wins today and BCC, is he HOY? If so, who would win Eclipse?

Originally Posted by Danzig

not necessarily.
well...then again, yeah he probably would when you consider who does most of the voting for the eclipse-many voters only pay attention twice a year, and big brown won the derby, so if he was to win the bcc, yeah he probably would get it.

i just don't see zenyatta getting it if big brown loses-not unless she contests the classic. the distaff is on friday now, not much coverage-most eclipse voters probably haven't heard of her, but have heard of curlin.

and that's the #1 problem with eclipse awards-the way they go about awarding them.

Originally Posted by RollerDoc

OK let's forget about HOY for a moment. Is Big Brown a lock for Eclipse even if he doesn't win today or BCC. Please tell me he is a lock. Four Grade 1 Stakes wins including KD and Preakness.

My argument here is Afleet Alex (one of my top 3 All Time favorites) won the Eclipse. Hasn't Big Brown at least equaled that resume?

Originally Posted by Danzig

he'll most likely get the eclipse for three year old. but keep in mind a horse wins that every year, it doesn't mean they are deserving of special praise. certainly afleet alex deserved it that year. doesn't mean he was anything particularly special-same with big brown.

Originally Posted by RollerDoc

Now I'm going to shift gears yet again. Nobody will convince me to not bet on Big Brown to win today. So since I am so stubborn, (based on only liking him) if money weren't an object, do you think my best bet in that scenario is to key him at the top of a trifecta with every other horse in the race? I think I would win more than betting him across the Board (provided he does indeed win).

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

Who cares who wins the eclipse? As a fan of the horse do you get something special if he wins?

If you are determined to bet him, use him in multirace plays. Pick3 or pick 4 if it's offered. Single him and try and catch a price, it's the only way to make any money on him IMO. But, I would suggest just watching the race. You seem to have elevated him to some kind of iconic status in your mind. So, if he wins, I'm sure you're going to be happier than Sumitas at the breeding shed. And if he loses, at least you haven't pissed away your money on a bad favorite.

Originally Posted by Danzig

i disagree. mineshaft still got hoy after skipping the bcc on the west coast. zenyatta beating the distaffers won't be enough to knock off curlin.
the only way it gets interesting is if big brown wins the classic.

i suppose you saw that now iavarone is claiming he's considering runnning big brown next year? seemed tho to be news to paul pompa and three chimneys.

Originally Posted by Danzig

you can say it as many times as you like, i would still disagree. azeri is the only mare to ever win hoy without facing males, but that was a year with no clear cut top male horse. this year is nothing like that. if big brown loses, curlin will get hoy, regardless of what zenyatta does. curlin may well get it even if big brown wins the classic-if big brown should lose today.

Originally Posted by Samarta

You really believe that Curlin could still win HOY if Big Brown wins the classic?

Originally Posted by Danzig

i thought i put that curlin would win if big brown lost the classic... i don't think he would win if big brown won the classic, but curlin still has more racing to do-and unlike big brown, curlin hasn't got an unexplained last place finish-and curlin is ranked the #1 horse in the world....
i'm not giving up all hope at this point for a curlin/big brown showdown. would certainly take care of the debate.
but after today, even before todays finish, i felt zenyattas only chance at hoy is to try the classic--and i really like her too. just don't think she'd get the votes over the other two.

Originally Posted by Samarta

Oh I think she would get the votes if neither BB or Curlin win the classic and she wins the distaff. Hell the field in the Distaff will probably be stronger than in the Classic

Originally Posted by King Glorious

Curlin, Heatseeker, Zenyatta, Proud Spell, Commentator, Indian Blessing, maybe Ginger Punch.

Originally Posted by hoovesupsideyourhead

I GOT 100 BUCKS SAYS HE DOES NOT WIN ON THE TURF PM ME IF YOU WANT SOME...

Originally Posted by Quiet Chris

NO WAY. The weather and the fact that nobody really cares about the race might keep it below 7500. Last weekend they got 2500, I wouldn't expect anything more than 10K. Nobody cares about Big Brown running against a bunch of grade 2 grass horses.

Now if he showed up for the JCGC, Belmont probably would get 25K for the Curlin-BB matchup.

Originally Posted by RollerDoc

And Big Brown still doesn't make your list of Top 5 horses this year?

Originally Posted by King Glorious

Did he beat one of the horses that I have ahead of him and I missed it? I'm much more impressed with him now than I was earlier in the day. He finally faced and beat some real horses. But I still don't think he's better than those I have listed. Just a matter of opinion. Perhaps he pushes Indian Blessing and Ginger Punch off but I still don't have him over Curlin, Heatseeker, Commentator, Zenyatta, and Proud Spell.

Originally Posted by RollerDoc

Nobody cares about Big Brown? Really? They got 17,000 plus. I told you they'd have north of 10,000. Why do you think the fans came out, just like they have in all of Big Brown's races? He is a very popular horse.

Originally Posted by Danzig

roller doc, you're taking a lot of people to task who have a lot more knowledge and have followed this sport a hell of a lot longer than you have. you're pretty presumptuous to think you can tell most of the people on this board anything-i can't believe that someone with your admitted lack of experience feels that you have the wherewithal to dress down some of the people here. it's absurd. i'd say most here have seen horses with big browns talent before, as well as plenty of horses over the years' with far more talent than him. it seems to be the general consensus on this board that big brown is indeed the top 3 yo male this year. maybe you could live with that, and get over it already.

Originally Posted by Coach Pants

That's like telling ESPN to remove mention of Big Brown's win from the ticker tonight. Not gonna happen. Shouldn't happen.

Originally Posted by Danzig

hey, i'm glad they put it up there-it's horse racing news. now if they start putting up results from cheerleading competition...well, that's another story.

this guys like a dog with a freaking bone, who here hasn't given that damn horse props? i don't think RD would be content unless big browns statue got put up in place of man o wars at the kentucky horse park.

Originally Posted by Danzig

hey, i'm glad they put it up there-it's horse racing news. now if they start putting up results from cheerleading competition...well, that's another story.

this guys like a dog with a freaking bone, who here hasn't given that damn horse props? i don't think RD would be content unless big browns statue got put up in place of man o wars at the kentucky horse park.