I guess after the Prix De L'Opera this isn't that surprising. I also wonder if after the performance of the filly that seemed close to Mandesha, Freedonia, in the Turf Classic, suddenly that group seemed a LOT weaker.

No jab thrown...it REALLY SUCKS FOR THE FANS IMO....seriously...

I found it fitting that he was the first one to post and it was in a negative fashion....I feel like a dogs that can't get rid of fleas....Life must really suck for some people....

Oh wow... you really set yourself up on this comment, but I won't go there... still too early in the day. :eek: :D

BTW, I still haven't seen or heard anything on Bernardini retiring or anything to that nature yet.....

You post for a reaction, Joel, and then complain when you get one?

This is absurd. Do I have to wait until two posters have responded to you? Three? Six? What is the acceptable number? Or, perhaps, you don't feel I have a right to respond.

Where to start?

BTW.. I blanked the early post in an attempt to quell an instant conflagration, but it didn't actually matter so it's back up.. and I'll add to the flames myself.

I thought this pair could add intrigue to the Cup and am sorry to see that they won't come, especially the filly...

As for Jim Toner Joel... WTF? Are you kidding? That's who you belittle? You couldn't pick a guy in NY more widely respected for his horsemanship and well liked for his character. His record is impeccable and his career is filled with enviable successes. He's as "small time" as he chooses to be basically training for the Phillips' only..

I don't know, maybe I'm wrong, but it felt like an argument was being started and I jumped in. Maybe I'm oversensitive, but when Godolphin's chief supporter on the site ( which Joel admittedly is....which doesn't make him a bad guy ) doesn't even check in on the " Bernardini retired " thread ( even if it's to say what he did in this thread...that he hadn't heard that ) but makes his first post after that thread about Coolmore ( Godolphin's big rival ) withholding horses from the BC, while suggesting one obviously had his heart broken by Bernardini ( Who as someone pointed out was always twenty in front of Dylan Thomas ) it seems to me he is looking to stir things up.

So I obliged.

Geez, I thought I was being nice....giving him what he wanted. Hey, I waited three minutes. Believe me, I'm not a patient guy, it was a LOOOOOOOOOONG three minutes.

alex would have had agreat chance in the filly and mares , esp with the extended furlong...
dylan can come back better next year but Coolmore have had some mixed successes with older horses and you never know..

It may leave the door open for Scorpion (who just returned froma year out) to go to KY.. maybe not but he is a very good horse!!

Because Toner doesn't use Dr. Allday. Coincidence? I think not.

Fleet Indian is the phoniest drug job I have EVER seen. I hate this horse now that she's with Pletcher (and I normally root for ALL NYB's) and she's going to be TAP's ticket to a lengthy suspension. Horses don't just magically improve 15-20 lengths from 4 to 5... especially modestly talented fillies who went off at 9-1 in a NYB stake to close out the year.

I had not heard anything on Bernardini and I still haven't, so when I saw btw blast me again in negative fashion it made me believe that he was tired of me talking about the 'big boys' again....he has been very vocal about thinking I give Coolmore and Darley too much praise, but hey, they have all of the good horses and I'm just presenting news...I can't help who owns the good ones...

It is clear that I'm bashed for supporting teh people who ultimately supoport this game in the biggest financial way be people in this forum who like the 'little guy' - and so I had to point out why the little guy doesn't make the news as often and give an example that would ht home to BTW...

I'm sure Toner is a great guy and he did good things with Wonder Again, etc....but I was pointing out that the big dogs (like Pletcher) are the ones that eat the most in this game and they make the news and if people don't like seeing Goliath win - I can't help that....

I still have yet to see anywhere on the wire where Bernardini has retired.....

Then why doesn't he hire him if you think that is the edge? Fleet Indian has gone to the test barn for her last 6 straight wins, or wahtever it is.....competitive edges, whereever they may be, is what sepeartes 25% trainers from 12% trainers...NOT using Toner in refernce here..just making a general point....why would you not use Dr. Allday if he could take an old NY-bred mare and have her win 4 or 5 straight graded stakes?

Steve Allday is not taking on new clients and hasn't been for a while..

The american breeders would disagree........

No, I don't and frankly I've stated how disappointed I'd be if they retire Bernardini prematurely, but let me ask you this, Mr. Trump:

What would you do if you owned an animal that was worth upwards of $100,000,000 ad that is a chip you could cash in? You would run him until he was 7, right? :rolleyes:

The "test barn" is a bunch of mularkey as far as im concerned. do you really think NYRA wouldn't "look the other way" if their most important trainer were a little over the limit on this way or that (especially considering things like the recent photo finish incident in indiana?) The thing that bugs me here is Pletcher has legitimately good horses like English Channel that DON'T need this crap, why risk your career on a horse like Fleet Indian when you already have half of the top 10 in the distaff division anyways??