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-   -   Zito Comes to His Senses (http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5192)

ateamstupid 10-03-2006 12:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tycharles01
The JCGC seems to me like a big moneymaker.

Bernardini is goin to be 3/5 or 4/5 and although tons of people dont think he needs/wants to be on the lead, he will be pushing the rabbit Spanish Chestnut for the first 7/7.5f. Guys like it or not Spanish Chestnut only has 1 job and that is to get out there and run like he is running a sprint,and Bernardini is not gonna like being far back,and if Chestnut runs the fractions they want him to you could finally see Bernardini dying in the stretch. (Note-Even tho this is not the best field, there will be no Double Galore,High Finance,or Hemingway's Key run against him going into the stretch)

Now I like Sun King alot,however like most say this is not his distance and if there are 9 or 10 horses in the race he might have a hard trip to the front. Def should catch alot of horses tiring with the pace tho

West Virginia might be a nice play after this is all said and done
Bernardini is not going to like being far back? And you know this, how? Did you two share a brew the other day or something?

9 or 10 horses? There are going to be five or six horses in this race, MAXIMUM.

Nostradamus 10-03-2006 06:06 AM
Why wouldn't he run him? If he can't run second or third here he doesn't belong in the BC.

Betsy 10-03-2006 07:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tycharles01
The JCGC seems to me like a big moneymaker.

Bernardini is goin to be 3/5 or 4/5 and although tons of people dont think he needs/wants to be on the lead, he will be pushing the rabbit Spanish Chestnut for the first 7/7.5f. Guys like it or not Spanish Chestnut only has 1 job and that is to get out there and run like he is running a sprint,and Bernardini is not gonna like being far back,and if Chestnut runs the fractions they want him to you could finally see Bernardini dying in the stretch. (Note-Even tho this is not the best field, there will be no Double Galore,High Finance,or Hemingway's Key run against him going into the stretch)

Now I like Sun King alot,however like most say this is not his distance and if there are 9 or 10 horses in the race he might have a hard trip to the front. Def should catch alot of horses tiring with the pace tho

West Virginia might be a nice play after this is all said and done
I'm not sure why you think Bernardini will be pushing Spanish Chestnut or why he doesn't like being far back. Have you seen his races prior to the Jim Dandy? And Tom Albertrani is quoted a saying he prefers Bernardini to run from off the pace. Frankly, so do I. Bernardini will not be dying in the stretch.

zippyneedsawin 10-03-2006 07:23 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tycharles01
The JCGC seems to me like a big moneymaker.

Bernardini is goin to be 3/5 or 4/5 and although tons of people dont think he needs/wants to be on the lead, he will be pushing the rabbit Spanish Chestnut for the first 7/7.5f. Guys like it or not Spanish Chestnut only has 1 job and that is to get out there and run like he is running a sprint,and Bernardini is not gonna like being far back,and if Chestnut runs the fractions they want him to you could finally see Bernardini dying in the stretch. (Note-Even tho this is not the best field, there will be no Double Galore,High Finance,or Hemingway's Key run against him going into the stretch)

Now I like Sun King alot,however like most say this is not his distance and if there are 9 or 10 horses in the race he might have a hard trip to the front. Def should catch alot of horses tiring with the pace tho

West Virginia might be a nice play after this is all said and done


I don't think Bernardini was anywhere near the pace in the Preakness.. and that worked out OK for him.

oracle80 10-03-2006 07:33 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seattleallstar
SUn King is a born loser, a hanger with no heart and class, During his 3 yr old yr he could compete with the best but barely win at the group 1 level
Jerry how ironic is it that the quote that you apply here, no heart and class, applies quite well to someone I know.

boswd 10-03-2006 08:28 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind
I love mile races, and agree that Sun King is probably best suited to that distance, but there are two major problems with having a mile dirt race in the BC. One is that many tracks can't even run the distance ( and there is a significant difference between one and two turn miles ) But, I think the biggest problem is it will detract from and dilute the other races.

I think the Met Mile and the Cigar Mile are the two best stakes of the year in NY ( though the Whitney seems to be the most exciting year in and year out ).

One thing about Sun King and 1 1/4, while I tend to agree with you, he hasn't gone that far since recently elevating his game. His races in the Commonwealth, Met, Whitney and probably even the Woodward are arguably the best races he has ever run. He may just be at the top of his game.
I don't know. I personally think Sun King just may be more than ready to tackle 10fs. Look at the way he was charging down the stretch in both the Whitney and the Woodward, if both of them had been 1 1/4 I think he may would have won them. He just may relish the extra distance. Sort of reminds me of Victory Gallop and 1 1/2. Was always just short and charging but with that extra distance he was able to pull it out.

dalakhani 10-03-2006 08:31 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by boswd
I don't know. I personally think Sun King just may be more than ready to tackle 10fs. Look at the way he was charging down the stretch in both the Whitney and the Woodward, if both of them had been 1 1/4 I think he may would have won them. He just may relish the extra distance. Sort of reminds me of Victory Gallop and 1 1/2. Was always just short and charging but with that extra distance he was able to pull it out.
I disagree. I dont think he wants to go that far. I think he would have a hard time either sustaining his run longer or having enough kick after going the extra distance.

Sun King has been admirable with what he has achieved but the added stretch would do him in.

randallscott35 10-03-2006 08:34 AM
I think Dala is right,

He is a great miler who can stretch to 9 if he has to. He can run admirable races at 10 but not Grade 1 winning at 10. He loses that punch down the lane. I don't think he is a hanger like most think.

Slewstoo 10-03-2006 08:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seattleallstar
Sun King is a loser defintely doesnt have the class to compete with the best
Don't be stupid...this horse has done nothing but compete with the "class" of the east coast all year long. To say he's a loser is asinine.

Scav 10-03-2006 08:42 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slewstoo
Don't be stupid...this horse has done nothing but compete with the "class" of the east coast all year long. To say he's a loser is asinine.
Your trying to talk sense to Seattle, that is like talking to a elephant and hoping for a response

Slewstoo 10-03-2006 08:44 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scav
Your trying to talk sense to Seattle, that is like talking to a elephant and hoping for a response
Good point, I just couldn't help myself (which usually happens when it comes to defending Sun King) :cool:

Scav 10-03-2006 08:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by randallscott35
I think Dala is right,

He is a great miler who can stretch to 9 if he has to. He can run admirable races at 10 but not Grade 1 winning at 10. He loses that punch down the lane. I don't think he is a hanger like most think.
agree, he doesn't hang, he still looks determined...You can see Perfect Drift just pull up in his eyes, if that makes any sense

I can't recall but has SK tried the turf? Maybe the Mile next year would be a good spot for him if he takes to it

Slewstoo 10-03-2006 08:49 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scav
agree, he doesn't hang, he still looks determined...You can see Perfect Drift just pull up in his eyes, if that makes any sense

I can't recall but has SK tried the turf? Maybe the Mile next year would be a good spot for him if he takes to it
He's never tried turf, but I would really like to see if he takes to it. Zito would be wise to take a Perfect Drift like approach next year and try Sun King on the turf for his first start of the season and see if he likes it. I like the idea.

Scav 10-03-2006 08:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slewstoo
He's never tried turf, but I would really like to see if he takes to it. Zito would be wise to take a Perfect Drift like approach next year and try Sun King on the turf for his first start of the season and see if he likes it. I like the idea.
Just looked at his pedigree, not really bred green too much, Charismatic has thrown a couple to like it though, not sure what their bottom sides were.....

http://www.pedigreequery.com/sun+king5

eurobounce 10-03-2006 09:00 AM
I hope Zito doesnt run Sun King this Saturday. There are going to be some horses that decide to run in the JCGC since Invasor is out of the race. I hope Zito decides to train Sun King up to the BCC. If SK races this Saturday, then I don't like him in the BCC. If he trains SK up to the BCC, then I love that horse in the BCC.

slotdirt 10-03-2006 09:00 AM
I still have my doubts whether Sun King will be back next year, but it's not like Farmer needs the money. I'm hoping he's around for at least another year. Assuming Bernardini is retired like many thinks he will be, Sun King could be the big kid on the block in the Classic division, that is, if he ever actually takes to winning at 10f.

Slewstoo 10-03-2006 09:06 AM
I really believe that if Sun King wins a G1 he'll be retired and stand for 20-25k. I hope I'm wrong because I would like to see what he does as a 5 year old, but in this day I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to see him retired if he gets the G1.

slotdirt 10-03-2006 09:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slewstoo
I really believe that if Sun King wins a G1 he'll be retired and stand for 20-25k. I hope I'm wrong because I would like to see what he does as a 5 year old, but in this day I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to see him retired if he gets the G1.
Well, you could be right. With Charismatic in Japan now, it's not like there's a lot of Summer Squalls standing in the US these days. Interesting fact about Charismatic is that both his sire and damsire come from the same Phalaris line.

Thunder Gulch 10-03-2006 09:44 AM
The new Perfect Drift....all/ SK / all

GenuineRisk 10-03-2006 10:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by slotdirt
I still have my doubts whether Sun King will be back next year, but it's not like Farmer needs the money. I'm hoping he's around for at least another year. Assuming Bernardini is retired like many thinks he will be, Sun King could be the big kid on the block in the Classic division, that is, if he ever actually takes to winning at 10f.
I'll hope Farmer keeps Sun King running for another year just 'cause I like him. I can dream, right?

I do hope he runs in the JCGC this weekend, for the purely selfish reason that I'm going to be there. :)


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