Now you got it!

And no I'm NOT in favor of public hospitals or even the thought of it.

BTW if it was important and timely I'd also use Fed Ex over the USPO.

So you think the health care mandate is constitutional, hospitals should be private, and there should be government single payer?

BTW, Cook County is a public hospital. So are VA hospitals. You think they should be shut down?

No a health care mandate with government hospitals and care is constitutional.

Mixing MANDATE and PRIVATE is where the problem lays. Not constitutional. Since I'm a very anti government-run anything much less healthcare this plan is something I'd throw in the garbage and say I'm happy with what I have.

That's completely, 100% nationalized healthcare. Government-employed doctors, government run hospitals.

The Supremes have already said other mixes of public and private, Social Security and Medicare, are constitutional. And the founders thought it constitutional, too (the articles I posted)

The plan doesn't make you change what you have. Your costs will go down, however. So be really angry about that. The plan gets the uninsured insured. The plan has already gotten many students and young people insured, and lowered prescription drug costs for seniors.

So how come MY insurance company made us change what we already had, and my costs went up by $600 ?? all because of Obamacare also.

Wow there's a suprise. Your insurance had to change and went up because of Obamacare.

There's 8,000 people working for the company i work for.. I will bet you 95% of them will not vote for Obama based on this ridiculous, costly health bill that makes my somewhat decent insurance turn into crap with an outrageously high deductable.

But Riot knows everything, and surely Obamacare had nothing to do with my insurance company changing all its coverage (and citing Obamacare as the reason).

I wasn't misled by Obama's lies in 2008 and wont be misled by this disgrace of a President in 2012. If you dont agree with Riot your deemed to be a hateful person.

GFY

i try to stay away from this discussion because there's so much misinformation passed off as fact. but given that very little in the bill goes into effect before 2014, your company might not be entirely truthful if they're actually telling you the healthcare bill is responsible for all reductions in coverage and increases in employee costs in 2011.

i'm not taking any position on the bill itself. you can like or dislike it. but if someone is telling you that changes taking effect 3 years from now affects the cost of your coverage today you should be skeptical.

According to RIOT "the plan has already gotten many students and young people insured, and lowered prescription drug costs for seniors."

The lowered prescription drug costs for seniors has to be diverted somewhere.

The idea that healthcare will be cheaper because of this bill is preposterous and based on deceptive use of numbers.

Didn't you forget that Riot knows everything.

It is being said on internet that California Blue Cross/Blue Shield is attempting raise rates 59%. Whatever is going to happen, the consumer will take it in the shorts!

Must be true. If it is being said on (the) internet, it has to be true.

Insurance costs have been increasing double digits for several years - it's just more of the same gouging by the insurance companies, and blaming it on something else. The provisions in the healthcare act that would help this won't kick in for another 2 years.

Nonsense and false. Let's be clear: I called your words about hispanics hateful because you're a bigot, and they were hateful words.

Not because you disagreed with me.

Yes, and CA BC & BS famously tried that last year, too, and were prevented from doing it by the Obama administration. And they raised alot the year before. That's not associated with the PPACA. That's insurance companies taking record profits while they kick off customers who cost them money.

That is one of the reasons why the PPACA was passed, however - to help control insurance costs.

I know more than you do about the healthcare bill. That's painfully obvious, that you are clueless about what's in it.

first of all, any claim of the founding fathers would.......fill in the blank, is disingenuous. the founding fathers didnt agree on much of anything individually, but could certainly school all of us on the art of compromise. thomas jefferson has to rolling in his grave at the current state of the bloated fed.

as for the law affecting things now, before its officially enacted....of course its had an effect. ins cos are being forced to expand coverage, they have to raise rates to stay ahead of the upcoming cost they...well, we, will have to pay.