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-   -   BC: Juv; Juv-F; Juv-T (PP's/Odds) (http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/showthread.php?t=17419)

Bobby Fischer 10-19-2007 07:38 AM

Fillies & Mares not "cheap" ?
 
It seems like in general and this season in particular that speed horses in the Filly and Mare division seem to hold better than the males.
Any thoughts on this?

Fillies & Mares have been stepping up in class and distance, and still no one is catching the speed. Where in males a class or distance change seems to leave one more vulnerable.
Again - these are only perceptions and I have no stats on this.

Still, the Juv-F does have a lot of speed and this is a unique race with a high level of quality. In the average stakes race the fast filly may be so much the class of the field by definition, where here in the BC there are several capable of winning.

fantini33 10-19-2007 10:04 AM

Take a long look at Backseat Rhythm in the Juvenile Fillies.

This Filly is getting good at exactly the right time, displays a strong closing kick in a race seemingly overloaded with speed, has handled two turns before, a fact which some of the choices in here cannot stake claim to, and will likely be ignored in the mutuels.

Examine her races carefully.

First try was on 8/2 at Saratoga in a 62,000 msw going 5 furlongs on WF dirt with Desormeaux up. Exits the gate at 27-1 and runs a decent 4th behind a few familiar names in Irish Smoke and Syriana's Song. This horse took no $$$$ in a 7 horse field with KD in the irons. What would she have gone off at otherwise, 40-1?

Second try was on 8/26 at Saratoga in another 62,000 msw, this time going 6 furlongs on a good track, with Desormeaux off and Castellano up. At this point it was clear that Desormeaux was having an incredible meet and yet the mount Desormeaux was on that day, a Matz trained horse floated up from the morning line while Rhythm floated down going off at 5-1. She ran 5th that day, closing from last at the head of the stretch, in a big field, well back though, screaming for more distance.

This is where it gets interesting.

Third try was on the Belmont Turf going 1 1/16 in a 53,000 msw, Castellano still up. 10-1 morning line........first flash is at 7/5. 7/5??? Granted, the switch from the quirky Saratoga dirt to the Belmont turf, coupled with the significant increase in distance would surely be a help....but 7/5? Somebody in the know was dropping some em-oh-en-e-y on this horse......and they were right. She made a strong move at the head of the stretch, off at 7-2, and withstood a late charge from what turns out to be a REALLY good filly in Country Star, who you might recall went down to Keeneland and smashed her maiden with a resounding Grade I win over the likes of Irish Smoke, A To The Croft, and Grace Anatomy. (As a side note, the horse that ran third that day, Mushka, runs in the 4th today at Belmont, her first race since that day)

Next out was going a mile on the dirt in the Frizzette. She runs a clear 2nd to 3/5 monster Indain Blessing, who had things on her own terms that day.

Backseat Rythym will be Reynolds only starter over the two days so the undivided attention should make her feel like a queen. She is sitting on a career performance. She will likely be double, even triple the odds of Smoke, Croft, and Anatomy. Backseat Rhythm will be the DEFINITION of overlay.

The distance will be right, the pace will be right, the price will be right.
Look for Backseat Rythym to blow up the toteboard and get the day started with a bang. I'll be backing up the Brinks truck.

Good Luck!

May a Derby Trailer lead the way to the window, and in this case, the tax window.

Later.

ED

brianwspencer 10-19-2007 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fantini33
Take a long look at Backseat Rhythm in the Juvenile Fillies.

I loved that one in her last and was a bit disappointed that she couldn't catch Indian Blessing after that one ran her last quarter in 27 and change. The good thing is that there seems to be a ton of speed in the Juvenile Fillies race, but I'm having a hard time (at this point, I've still got a week!) making a case for a horse who couldn't catch a leader who was stumbling home through an insanely slow final quarter.

I'm sure she'll be on some of my tickets, but I'd like her a whole lot better if she would've cut down that gap a bit more in her last considering it was basically dangled right in front of her by the winner and she couldn't take it.

fantini33 10-19-2007 02:46 PM

I think if you watch her only two turn race (actually one turn going 1 1/16th) she got in a much better position, closer to the front and was able to move BEFORE Country Star, enabling her to get home. The one turn race (shorter distance) left her too much to do with too little ground with which to do it. I just suspect that she is moving forward, will get first run, and hopefully pick them up without letting someone come from the clouds and go on by. Indian Blessing put it away early that day and Rhythm did make up about 10 lengths in the last half, going pretty wide on the turn to finish 3.5 lengths behind.

I concede that she has to move forward here to make it happen, but value will be in her corner, which means it will be in mine.

With a week to go, everyone is searching for confident angles, myself included.

Ed

blackthroatedwind 10-19-2007 03:09 PM

All of Backseat Rhythm's races have been around one turn.

fantini33 10-19-2007 03:11 PM

Just watched the replay again, and yes, one turn at Belmont for a 1 1/16th on the turf. 1 1/8th on the inner is two turns. My bad....but I still feel that the two turns will be to her liking, not sure the other fillies will agree.

Thanks for pointing that out, I missed it.

nomad 10-21-2007 01:35 AM

Strike the Deal is my top pick.

Ibn whatever & Domestic Fund under

ELA 10-21-2007 12:03 PM

Majestic Warrior out. I am glad they were able to find what the problem was -- rather than push the envelope, run him, and make matters worse. I'd really like to see this colt come back healthy, fit, 100% and ready to go. Sounds like he could be back in a few days.

Eric

Kasept 10-22-2007 03:29 AM

Overextended Juvenile/Juvenile Turf Hollywood ParK 5 furlongs 1.00:40
Gio Ponti Juvenile Turf Belmont Park 4 furlongs 48:18
Shore Do Juvenile/Juvenile Turf Monmouth Park 5 furlongs 1.02:00
Cherokee Triangle Juvenile Turf Churchill Training 5 furlongs 1.00:40
Your Round Juvenile Turf Keeneland 5 furlongs 1.02:20
Texas Fever Juvenile Turf/Juvenile Keeneland 5 furlongs 1.01:40
Old Man Buck Juvenile/Juvenile Turf Keeneland 5 furlongs 59:80
The Leopard Juvenile Turf Belmont Park 4 furlongs 50:


Backseat Rhythm Juvenile Fillies Belmont Park 6 furlongs 1.14:23
A to the Croft Juvenile Fillies Keeneland 5 furlongs 59:80
Grace Anatomy Juvenile Fillies Keeneland 5 furlongs 1.03:00
Tasha's Miracle Juvenile Fillies Santa Anita 6 furlongs 1.12:00
Indian Blessing Juvenile Fillies Belmont Park 5 furlongs 58:42
Irish Smoke Juvenile Fillies Keeneland 5 furlongs 58:40
Izarra Juvenile Fillies Santa Anita 6 furlongs 1.14:20
Phantom Income Juvenile Fillies Aqueduct 4 furlongs 47:61
Smarty Deb Juvenile Fillies Monmouth Park 5 furlongs 1.00:20


Wicked Style Juvenile Keeneland 5 furlongs 1.00:80
Globalization Juvenile Aqueduct 5 furlongs 1.00:23
Salute the Sarge Juvenile Hollywood Park 5 furlongs 1.02:20

freddymo 10-22-2007 01:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fantini33
Take a long look at Backseat Rhythm in the Juvenile Fillies.

This Filly is getting good at exactly the right time, displays a strong closing kick in a race seemingly overloaded with speed, has handled two turns before, a fact which some of the choices in here cannot stake claim to, and will likely be ignored in the mutuels.

Examine her races carefully.

First try was on 8/2 at Saratoga in a 62,000 msw going 5 furlongs on WF dirt with Desormeaux up. Exits the gate at 27-1 and runs a decent 4th behind a few familiar names in Irish Smoke and Syriana's Song. This horse took no $$$$ in a 7 horse field with KD in the irons. What would she have gone off at otherwise, 40-1?

Second try was on 8/26 at Saratoga in another 62,000 msw, this time going 6 furlongs on a good track, with Desormeaux off and Castellano up. At this point it was clear that Desormeaux was having an incredible meet and yet the mount Desormeaux was on that day, a Matz trained horse floated up from the morning line while Rhythm floated down going off at 5-1. She ran 5th that day, closing from last at the head of the stretch, in a big field, well back though, screaming for more distance.

This is where it gets interesting.

Third try was on the Belmont Turf going 1 1/16 in a 53,000 msw, Castellano still up. 10-1 morning line........first flash is at 7/5. 7/5??? Granted, the switch from the quirky Saratoga dirt to the Belmont turf, coupled with the significant increase in distance would surely be a help....but 7/5? Somebody in the know was dropping some em-oh-en-e-y on this horse......and they were right. She made a strong move at the head of the stretch, off at 7-2, and withstood a late charge from what turns out to be a REALLY good filly in Country Star, who you might recall went down to Keeneland and smashed her maiden with a resounding Grade I win over the likes of Irish Smoke, A To The Croft, and Grace Anatomy. (As a side note, the horse that ran third that day, Mushka, runs in the 4th today at Belmont, her first race since that day)

Next out was going a mile on the dirt in the Frizzette. She runs a clear 2nd to 3/5 monster Indain Blessing, who had things on her own terms that day.

Backseat Rythym will be Reynolds only starter over the two days so the undivided attention should make her feel like a queen. She is sitting on a career performance. She will likely be double, even triple the odds of Smoke, Croft, and Anatomy. Backseat Rhythm will be the DEFINITION of overlay.

The distance will be right, the pace will be right, the price will be right.
Look for Backseat Rythym to blow up the toteboard and get the day started with a bang. I'll be backing up the Brinks truck.

Good Luck!

May a Derby Trailer lead the way to the window, and in this case, the tax window.

Later.

ED

She has a shot but the Fav is pretty good and this one needs to get much better fast or get an enormous break to win.. She looks a bit MOTO in this race and will certainly be a bit of an underlay even with the fav being over bet as well

SCUDSBROTHER 10-23-2007 07:14 PM

I'm taking Phantom Income with that inside speed(to hold on for 3rd.)90% chance Coa will fan lil wide into the 1st turn.Just a guess.

my miss storm cat 10-24-2007 11:14 AM

Cry and Catch Me is out..... :(

NoChanceToDance 10-24-2007 11:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by my miss storm cat
Cry and Catch Me is out..... :(

Didn't think she had much of a shot with so much pace in the race, anyway.

Bobby Fischer 10-24-2007 11:46 AM

The Juvenile is looking to be an interesting race.
War Pass has been THE superstar of the 2yo season so far. This race should have a nice mix of styles and maybe some longshots will challenge as well.

Mike 10-24-2007 07:48 PM

Juvenile Fillies, 2 yo girls subject to sudden maturation-and emotional development-I'll take an educated stab at an apparent headcase, Phantom Income. Will come from off the pace

However, due to everything looking ripe for Indian Blessing, I'll box the two in the exacta

Mike 10-24-2007 08:16 PM

In the Juvenile Turf, not much history to go on, especially as far as soft ground is concerned. Cannonball has handled yielding turf, just 5 days prior to the race. 2-2 on grass, I'll look for that 50-1

Will use Cannonball and Gio Ponti in the doubles and Pick 3 with Discreet Cat

2 Dollar Bill 10-26-2007 08:48 AM

Does anyone have a idea why Doug O'Neill is using Jockey Dettori in both of his 2 year old races ? A new trainer/jockey angle ? :confused:

Pedigree Ann 10-27-2007 02:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fantini33
Take a long look at Backseat Rhythm in the Juvenile Fillies.

ED

And I might add, that her pedigree says an off track is right up her alley.

fantini33 10-31-2007 07:09 AM

Backseat Rythym

One of the longest shots of the day to hit the board, photo'd out for 2nd, gets 3rd and pays 9.60 to do so, going off at 19-1.

I take little solace in this fact as I had her to win and place, and on the top and bottom of exactas, including with Indian Blessing.

She did run well though.


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