Sad Day for Beyer Haters

[blackthroatedwind]

He actually picked Street Sense......and Cowtown Cat for last!

[randallscott35]

He actually picked Street Sense......and Cowtown Cat for last!

Good for him. He's a legend. Doesn't mean he's the best capper obviously but he has as big an impact on the wagering public as anyone in the last 50 years.

[ArlJim78]

His BSF figures led directly to the trifecta as well.

[blackthroatedwind]

I'm just having fun.

Personally this is a rare Derby for me where I'm very happy with the results. I have liked Street Sense for a long time, I thought Hard Spun ran an outstanding race and honestly didn't deserve to lose, and all the horses I didn't like ran poorly.....like Scat Daddy and Cowtown Cat. I also am not Circular Quay's biggest fan and honestly felt it would be a bad precedent for a horse to win off an eight week layoff.

I think, for once, it may well be fair to say the best three horses made up the trifecta. A good day for racing.

[DCracing]

I'm just having fun.

Personally this is a rare Derby for me where I'm very happy with the results. I have liked Street Sense for a long time, I thought Hard Spun ran an outstanding race and honestly didn't deserve to lose, and all the horses I didn't like ran poorly.....like Scat Daddy and Cowtown Cat. I also am not Circular Quay's biggest fan and honestly felt it would be a bad precedent for a horse to win off an eight week layoff.

I think, for once, it may well be fair to say the best three horses made up the trifecta. A good day for racing.


Andy!!! Thanks for the link to your youbet shows - watched the last 2, shared the link with my friends - both shows were well produced with great stuff. Too bad i am a not a good listener! Definitely agree with the earlier post about beyer's figs.

I think your recent emphatic point on ATRAB about running your horses came home today. I also think we might see a record crowd for the Belmont!

[Pedigree Ann]

I'm just having fun.

Personally this is a rare Derby for me where I'm very happy with the results. I have liked Street Sense for a long time, I thought Hard Spun ran an outstanding race and honestly didn't deserve to lose, and all the horses I didn't like ran poorly.....like Scat Daddy and Cowtown Cat. I also am not Circular Quay's biggest fan and honestly felt it would be a bad precedent for a horse to win off an eight week layoff.

I think, for once, it may well be fair to say the best three horses made up the trifecta. A good day for racing.

My feelings exactly! A highly satisfactory outcome. My money was on Hard Spun (heart as much as head) but I knew Street Sense was the danger. Curlin showed he has talent and only lacked the conditioning to play a more prominent role. Also, we saw prepping on Poly is not death, and that a race 3 weeks out is better than one 4,5,6 or 8 weeks out.

[MisterB]

He actually picked Street Sense......and Cowtown Cat for last!

Me too, I am in good company

easy money

good going Andy B

[philcski]

I'm just having fun.

Personally this is a rare Derby for me where I'm very happy with the results. I have liked Street Sense for a long time, I thought Hard Spun ran an outstanding race and honestly didn't deserve to lose, and all the horses I didn't like ran poorly.....like Scat Daddy and Cowtown Cat. I also am not Circular Quay's biggest fan and honestly felt it would be a bad precedent for a horse to win off an eight week layoff.

I think, for once, it may well be fair to say the best three horses made up the trifecta. A good day for racing.

Agreed, my disdain for Assmussen nonwithstanding the 3 best ran in that order.

I had a dream last night that Hard Spun led to the quarter pole and Street Sense ran him down to win, with a pink silked Silverton Hill horse getting up for 3rd. For a flash at the sixteenth pole I felt like phucking Nostradamus.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

He actually picked Street Sense......and Cowtown Cat for last!

Yes, but, did he increase his lead to like 125 points in the TVG contest?

Cowtown Cat somehow didn't beat out Stormello, who was my stone cold lock to finish last---and I believe finished 19th.

I really can't wait to bet against Street Sense again---with Dominguez on fairly tactical, and not-that-dangerous Chelokee, the rail should finally be sealed.

[Hickory Hill Hoff]

I'm just having fun.

Personally this is a rare Derby for me where I'm very happy with the results. I have liked Street Sense for a long time, I thought Hard Spun ran an outstanding race and honestly didn't deserve to lose, and all the horses I didn't like ran poorly.....like Scat Daddy and Cowtown Cat. I also am not Circular Quay's biggest fan and honestly felt it would be a bad precedent for a horse to win off an eight week layoff.

I think, for once, it may well be fair to say the best three horses made up the trifecta. A good day for racing.

Yes...those were the three and nobody else showed up, expect the "wildandcrazy" one. A very logical finish.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

He's always knocked for his Derby picks, and this year he picked the winner and the last place finisher....

Which is why it's a sad day for his haters.


This is one of the tougher races to handicap all year long---and no matter how excellent a better, they will make their mistakes in this race. Any Given Saturday ran a dreadful 8th for me.

[blackthroatedwind]

He's always knocked for his Derby picks, and this year he picked the winner and the last place finisher....

Which is why it's a sad day for his haters.


This is one of the tougher races to handicap all year long---and no matter how excellent a better, they will make their mistakes in this race. Any Given Saturday ran a dreadful 8th for me.


Thus a good day for DrugS haters?

Not that there are any....or should be.

By the way, it's bettor.

[cmorioles]

To be fair, AGS was doomed after the post draw. Hopefully this result will end this ridiculous thought that the outside is better than the inside.

[ninetoone]

I'm glad Beyer finally picked the winner, but unfortunately it was the favorite & alot of people/experts had it. War Emblem @ 20-1 w/the top prep BSF was his opportunity to become a handicapping "God"...how did he miss that one? That must p*ss him off...

[The Indomitable DrugS]

I take speed figures very seriously, in dirt races run at commonly run distances anyway, and there are a lot of times when I'm not betting the horse with the top figures.

If you look at the Derby, Curlin was the horse with the top last-out figure, and Beyer wrote a piece about him (that I was no fan of) knocking his chances...saying he'd finish in the second half of the field.

Knowing how fast a horse is capable of running is very important, but, the way the figure was earned is more important than all else.

And, there are going to be times when a horse is dominant on figures, and all of his dominant figures are numbers he earned with no candy trips, or smoke and mirrors....and I still will play against the horse because I project the way the race will be run figures to work against said horse.

I think it's a big misconception that people who take figures seriously use them as the main basis for all handicapping opinions.

[Pointg5]

In his column about Curlin, he stated that he'd be lucky to finish in the Top 10, I wouldn't say it was a banner day for Beyer. They do not pay out for last place in the mutuels, while it was a good guess, it gets you nothing. Street Sense was the logical pick and he should get credit for not trying to go outside of the box, but it wasn't like Beyer crushed this thing.

Thorograph loved SS and they liked Hard Spun, not so much Curlin, but at least they had the exacta.

[cmorioles]

In his column about Curlin, he stated that he'd be lucky to finish in the Top 10, I wouldn't say it was a banner day for Beyer. They do not pay out for last place in the mutuels, while it was a good guess, it gets you nothing.

I guarantee you if you want to place a bet on the last place finisher, you can do so.

[Pointg5]

I guarantee you if you want to place a bet on the last place finisher, you can do so.

Not in the mutuals, maybe in some off shore book, but I said mutuals...

[SentToStud]

It's wonderful that there's a thread on this even if the last time this would have been appropriate is when Spanky and Alfalfa were all the rage.

[King Glorious]

I'm just having fun.

Personally this is a rare Derby for me where I'm very happy with the results. I have liked Street Sense for a long time, I thought Hard Spun ran an outstanding race and honestly didn't deserve to lose, and all the horses I didn't like ran poorly.....like Scat Daddy and Cowtown Cat. I also am not Circular Quay's biggest fan and honestly felt it would be a bad precedent for a horse to win off an eight week layoff.

I think, for once, it may well be fair to say the best three horses made up the trifecta. A good day for racing.

I'm not so sure it's a good day for racing. For today, it was. I didn't have the winner but am very happy with the results. To see all of the jinxes broken at once was great. The winner was the 2yo champ and BC Juv winner and ran only two preps. The second place horse hadn't raced in six weeks. The third place horse had only three career starts and none as a 2yo. This was great to me. And I agree with u that the three best horses were the top three. But.......

Was it good for the future of racing? I'm not so sure. We know how many trainers are copycats of what works one time. We saw Barbaro win with a five week layoff so this year we saw a couple of main contenders with long layoffs in Hard Spun and Circular Quay. Because of Street Sense's success, we'll see more horses going into the race off of only two preps. So I'm wondering if next season's prep races are really going to see the effects of the success of Street Sense, Hard Spun, and Curlin.

[Danzig]

I'm not so sure it's a good day for racing. For today, it was. I didn't have the winner but am very happy with the results. To see all of the jinxes broken at once was great. The winner was the 2yo champ and BC Juv winner and ran only two preps. The second place horse hadn't raced in six weeks. The third place horse had only three career starts and none as a 2yo. This was great to me. And I agree with u that the three best horses were the top three. But.......

Was it good for the future of racing? I'm not so sure. We know how many trainers are copycats of what works one time. We saw Barbaro win with a five week layoff so this year we saw a couple of main contenders with long layoffs in Hard Spun and Circular Quay. Because of Street Sense's success, we'll see more horses going into the race off of only two preps. So I'm wondering if next season's prep races are really going to see the effects of the success of Street Sense, Hard Spun, and Curlin.

but i think those top three horses were handled correctly--but what works for one horse (hard spuns layoff) doesn't work for another--say, circular quay. just like the layoff worked for rags, but not her stablemate. going poly to dirt worked for street sense, but not dominican.

i'd rather have a trainer who maps out the right route for his horse, rather than saying hey, it worked for so and so, i'll try it too.

[King Glorious]

but i think those top three horses were handled correctly--but what works for one horse (hard spuns layoff) doesn't work for another--say, circular quay. just like the layoff worked for rags, but not her stablemate. going poly to dirt worked for street sense, but not dominican.

i'd rather have a trainer who maps out the right route for his horse, rather than saying hey, it worked for so and so, i'll try it too.

I agree with u. But I've also seen how these guys do. They will see that it won the race and ran second and third and more will try it just for that reason. If Barbaro hadn't won the Derby last year, maybe some of the horses that used layoffs would have run one more time.

[Skip away]

Street Sense was impossible to come up with. How did he ever select such an unlikely winner? Have not checked the mutuals but I believe Street Sense paid $100 to win. I think Beyer was the only public handicapper to have correctly picked him. Never doubt this guy again.

[randallscott35]

Street Sense was impossible to come up with. How did he ever select such an unlikely winner? Have not checked the mutuals but I believe Street Sense paid $100 to win. I think Beyer was the only public handicapper to have correctly picked him. Never doubt this guy again.
Not unfair at all....Plus Curlin didn't finish in the bottom 10 either.

[blackthroatedwind]

Street Sense was impossible to come up with. How did he ever select such an unlikely winner? Have not checked the mutuals but I believe Street Sense paid $100 to win. I think Beyer was the only public handicapper to have correctly picked him. Never doubt this guy again.


So, in other words, it doesn't count if you pick a winner an other people like the same horse....or he's the favorite.

Good to know that in order to correctly pick a winner the horse must be 50-1 and also picked by nobody else. By the way, I don't remember your Derby selection.

[cmorioles]

Sometimes there is no need to try and be clever. Just bet the best horse and cash. That is what Beyer did I assume.

I'm not sure what he can do to make some people happy.

[ArlJim78]

Not unfair at all....Plus Curlin didn't finish in the bottom 10 either.
You still maintain the attitude and cockiness. I would have thought that you of all people would be more humble in the aftermath of this derby. There can hardly be anyone anywhere that was more wrong about the outcome.

[randallscott35]

You still maintain the attitude and cockiness. I would have thought that you of all people would be more humble in the aftermath of this derby. There can hardly be anyone anywhere that was more wrong about the outcome.

What the hell is this? See the other post in Crow....What attitude? I was wrong on him. He won the race. He was the favorite. He won the race. I thought he wouldn't start. He won the race. I thought he'd never win a Grade 1 again. He won the race. I made the call in November. It is May. I was wrong....So I can't have an opinion on a race ever again. Of the horses I picked in the race they finished 2,3, and 5....This is why people don't stick there neck out on here. B/c when they admit they were wrong and move on its not good enough. You wonder why people simply lurk....What would you like me to do exactly? My question is, if Cowtown Cat had finished say 3rd in this race. Would all of you be pounding Andy? I doubt it. Instead you'd keep your kneepads on just a bit longer.

[brianwspencer]

My question is, if Cowtown Cat had finished say 3rd in this race. Would all of you be pounding Andy? I doubt it. Instead you'd keep your kneepads on just a bit longer.

I'm pretty sure he would have caught hell for it.

[blackthroatedwind]

My question is, if Cowtown Cat had finished say 3rd in this race. Would all of you be pounding Andy? I doubt it. Instead you'd keep your kneepads on just a bit longer.


So now it's about me?

Get a grip....Cowtown Cat finished 20th. I don't want, or expect, or need, anyone to compliment me about my opinions on this or any race, but you now sticking me in this discussion, especially in a shitty way, is REALLY lame.

I do take the heat when I'm wrong, and joke about it, and even make fun of myself publicly sometimes. One thing I wouldn't do, however, is talk about all the things I was mildly right about after I had humiliated myself as badly as you did with Street Sense.

[randallscott35]

So now it's about me?

Get a grip....Cowtown Cat finished 20th. I don't want, or expect, or need, anyone to compliment me about my opinions on this or any race, but you now sticking me in this discussion, especially in a shitty way, is REALLY lame.

I do take the heat when I'm wrong, and joke about it, and even make fun of myself publicly sometimes. One thing I wouldn't do, however, is talk about all the things I was mildly right about after I had humiliated myself as badly as you did with Street Sense.

I wasn't bringing you into anything, gimme a break. I'm simply making a point that consistency doesn't exist around here....And now I was humiliated? LOL. I've never even rooted against the horse as I posted months ago. This is a gambling game Andy isn't it. You bet what you think. I posted what I thought at the time.

[ninetoone]

I'll throw this in...I'm far more impressed by the fact that he tossed Cowtown Cat & publicly picked him to finish last than the fact that he picked the favorite to win the Derby. Cowtown Rat had some buzz by some wiseguys & I personally thought he had a chance to hit the board if things played out right.

[blackthroatedwind]

I wasn't bringing you into anything, gimme a break. I'm simply making a point that consistency doesn't exist around here....And now I was humiliated? LOL. I've never even rooted against the horse as I posted months ago. This is a gambling game Andy isn't it. You bet what you think. I posted what I thought at the time.


Yes, you were humiliated. The fact that you don't see that is probably why in your " I am eating crow " post you started off by saying Street Sense wasn't even the best horse in the race and mostly talked about how you were right about Sedgefield.

To each his ( or her ) own.....but I think when someone is as wrong as you were, and as vociferous as you were, they should be a LOT more contrite. When I put the dunce cap on, and announced " I'm a dunce ", I didn't whine that Cowtown Cat rode a gold rail and crawling pace to victory. I simply said I was dunce and moved on.....I didn't add that I thought Dominican was the horse to use to make money in the Blue Grass. Everything else is irrelevent to the focal point.

[randallscott35]

Yes, you were humiliated. The fact that you don't see that is probably why in your " I am eating crow " post you started off by saying Street Sense wasn't even the best horse in the race and mostly talked about how you were right about Sedgefield.

To each his ( or her ) own.....but I think when someone is as wrong as you were, and as vociferous as you were, they should be a LOT more contrite. When I put the dunce cap on, and announced " I'm a dunce ", I didn't whine that Cowtown Cat rode a gold rail and crawling pace to victory. I simply said I was dunce and moved on.....I didn't add that I thought Dominican was the horse to use to make money in the Blue Grass. Everything else is irrelevent to the focal point.

Fair enough. My initial post about SS wasn't gracious enough I guess. Subsequent posts in the thread surely were...I will say though, that the horse that runs the fastest Juvy in history is probably going to run well again in his life....So I most likely was going to be wrong when I wrote it...And alas, I was.

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

What the hell is this? See the other post in Crow....What attitude? I was wrong on him. He won the race. He was the favorite. He won the race. I thought he wouldn't start. He won the race. I thought he'd never win a Grade 1 again. He won the race. I made the call in November. It is May. I was wrong....So I can't have an opinion on a race ever again. Of the horses I picked in the race they finished 2,3, and 5....This is why people don't stick there neck out on here. B/c when they admit they were wrong and move on its not good enough. You wonder why people simply lurk....What would you like me to do exactly? My question is, if Cowtown Cat had finished say 3rd in this race. Would all of you be pounding Andy? I doubt it. Instead you'd keep your kneepads on just a bit longer.
you really are a an azz hole.........

[randallscott35]

you really are a an azz hole.........
Please see the post for you in the other thread Matt. One nasty fellow you are. I don't curse at anyone on here.

[Skip away]

By the way, I don't remember your Derby selection

I boxed cowtown cat & curlin. Boy was I wrong.

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

Please see the post for you in the other thread Matt. One nasty fellow you are. I don't curse at anyone on here.
well randall you have a habit of bringing andy in to "a we all kiss his ass" comment alot.. we are lucky to have him here he has more insight in his toe than your whole body.. so take it for what its worth..you constantly have that attitude ..its getting old.. i havent seen your show on you bet randall...whats it called...

[Cajungator26]

Boy am I bubbling with excitement to meet all of you guys in Toga... :eek:

[Danzig]

i'm beginning to think brian wasn't the only one to have too many beers yesterday.....

[brianwspencer]

i'm beginning to think brian wasn't the only one to have too many beers yesterday.....

But, as usual, I posted reasonably responsibly. :D

[Danzig]

lol

hey, did you puke?? drink plenty of water today, gotta rehydrate.

[randallscott35]

i'm beginning to think brian wasn't the only one to have too many beers yesterday.....

You think?


The biggest issue here is the lack of civility.... Disagree. Make your points...Why is cursing necessary?...There are some educated people on here who can't make a sentence without cursing someone out who they don't agree with or don't like. For what purpose?

[brianwspencer]

lol

hey, did you puke?? drink plenty of water today, gotta rehydrate.

No I didn't hork, but stumbled into the bedroom for a post-Derby nap and was a mess all night after I woke up -- Jamie got a front row seat to me chatting my head off with her when I called her later last night. It was a good conversation but I was all over the place.

Felt terrible this morning on the way to work, but have downed probably about a gallon of water throughout the workday and now I feel spry as ever.

[Cajungator26]

No I didn't hork, but stumbled into the bedroom for a post-Derby nap and was a mess all night after I woke up -- Jamie got a front row seat to me chatting my head off with her when I called her later last night. It was a good conversation but I was all over the place.

Felt terrible this morning on the way to work, but have downed probably about a gallon of water throughout the workday and now I feel spry as ever.

You sounded great to me, B... at least you were coherent. When I drink, it's all over with. :o

[brianwspencer]

You sounded great to me, B... at least you were coherent. When I drink, it's all over with. :o

I just couldn't decide what I want to talk about. Beyers, Scat Daddy, cases of beer I missed out on, Cupcake fighting, fourth generation dams, etc. I've never covered so many topics in such a short time with another racing fan.

[Danzig]

uh oh, drunk dialing....lol


and i agree randall, you started a thread just to say hey, i was wrong...i mean, i don't expect you to go buy a gallon of gas and douse yourself and light a match since you went out on a limb and fell off....

it happens to all of us at some point, unless of course you never state an opinion! i could very well have been in there in your place, after five months of talking up a colt.

but yeah, it's a shame that insults fly fast around here at times. certainly doesn't add to the conversation.

[randallscott35]

uh oh, drunk dialing....lol


and i agree randall, you started a thread just to say hey, i was wrong...i mean, i don't expect you to go buy a gallon of gas and douse yourself and light a match since you went out on a limb and fell off....

it happens to all of us at some point, unless of course you never state an opinion! i could very well have been in there in your place, after five months of talking up a colt.

but yeah, it's a shame that insults fly fast around here at times. certainly doesn't add to the conversation.
I have added the Dunce for Street Sense and put it in my signature. I will leave it there till next Derby. That's 1 year. Hopefully a year of shame will do the trick.

[Danzig]

i would just hate for people to hold back on their opinions, on their point of view, around here because they're afraid to be taken to the wood shed if they're wrong.

[Cajungator26]

I just couldn't decide what I want to talk about. Beyers, Scat Daddy, cases of beer I missed out on, Cupcake fighting, fourth generation dams, etc. I've never covered so many topics in such a short time with another racing fan.

I still can't believe that Imawildandcrazyguy had an original name like Cupcake Melee... how awful. LMAO

You guys would have laughed at Brian correcting my pronunciation of 'melee.' Haha

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

I have added the Dunce for Street Sense and put it in my signature. I will leave it there till next Derby. That's 1 year. Hopefully a year of shame will do the trick.
why dont you change your avatar....hmmm

[Pointg5]

I have added the Dunce for Street Sense and put it in my signature. I will leave it there till next Derby. That's 1 year. Hopefully a year of shame will do the trick.

If you have to do that, why don't you put one in for picking Pleasant Home...

[Pointg5]

i would just hate for people to hold back on their opinions, on their point of view, around here because they're afraid to be taken to the wood shed if they're wrong.

It's fine to have an opinion and state it, it's part of the handicapping process to eliminate horses, but to come back and want praise because you picked a horse not to win, especially the Derby, is rediculous...

[randallscott35]

why dont you change your avatar....hmmm
B/c I like Andy. I always have. Its a funny thing. And an homage...Plus orange is my fave color.

[randallscott35]

If you have to do that, why don't you put one in for picking Pleasant Home...

I have a beautiful framed photo of her in midflight. I love that horse.

[Cajungator26]

It's fine to have an opinion and state it, it's part of the handicapping process to eliminate horses, but to come back and want praise because you picked a horse not to win, especially the Derby, is rediculous...

No, it's ridiculous.

Just giving you shiat... lmao.

[Danzig]

It's fine to have an opinion and state it, it's part of the handicapping process to eliminate horses, but to come back and want praise because you picked a horse not to win, especially the Derby, is rediculous...

everyone on here has a right to state anything, and any one else can disagree. it's the name calling that seems to be the issue. rand came on and took his lumps, started a crow thread to do so. unlike some who have come on in the past, and disappeared, he came in today saying he was wrong. why he has to be called names and take more than his share of grief i don't know.


or maybe it's his day, long as he's getting picked on, i guess a lot of others are being left alone.

[Danzig]

No, it's ridiculous.

Just giving you shiat... lmao.

ah, cajun, was wondering how much longer you were going to keep your avatar.

[Cajungator26]

ah, cajun, was wondering how much longer you were going to keep your avatar.

I had to change it...

Lori (antitrust) will be drinking 12 of those on my dime, dammit! :mad:

Damn Curlin! LOL

[Pointg5]

No, it's ridiculous.

Just giving you shiat... lmao.

I would have bet my life ridiculous was spelled rediculous...I am still traumitized(sp?) over that one.

[Danzig]

I would have bet my life ridiculous was spelled rediculous...I am still traumitized(sp?) over that one.


lol

traumA


slow news day if we all start playing spell checkers.

[SentToStud]

Anyone find it curious that after his Breeders Cup column that was sharply critical of the Sheikhs impact on U.S. racing, Beyer didn't mention Darley's success with Street Cry, the Derby winner's sire?

Nice to see this U.S.-based stallion succeed for Darley here. A bargain for Mo at $400k.

[Skip away]

he also said invasor was too slow to beat our handicap horses last year, before the Pim Special. That turned out to be well, off just a teencey weencey bit :D